Campagnolo 11 speed using 34/50x11/36! Yes it can be done with PRE-2015 Athena LC Big Gears on Campagnolo 11 speed

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
colnagoaddict
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2017 7:53 pm

by colnagoaddict

Valbrona wrote:Tried 36 sprocket with original 10 speed Record ... poor shifting on biggest sprockets and too much cross chaining.

I much prefer triples.
Yeah the 10 speed rigs I have I use a triple. Or 32 2x max. Ird made a 34 10 speed but sold out a long time ago. If you try 10 speed shimano the spacing is too far off and shifts like crap. 11speed is close enough to match using a shitmano campatible cassette with a campy drivetrain.

NoTe: you have to use the right version of 11 speed campy there are 3 generations of Campy 11 speed and none play nice with a different generation....Frieeky Italian italian engineering at its finest! Lo :D l

graeme_f_k
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by graeme_f_k

Just remember this true story guys ...

I had to refuse an EPS warranty today, because someone decided it was a good idea to transplant a medium cage onto his EPS RD and run it with a 32 bottom.

He'd read it would be "OK" on a forum ...

It all shifted fine, chain wrap was OK, so big to big worked ... so, you may ask, why don't Campag offer it as an option? Everybody wants it ... easy win, no?

I'll tell you. Campagnolo tested it. It didn't even get as far as the teams ... the R and D riders at the factory found that the chain can over-run on the smallest sprocket shift and jam between the frame and the casette ... it doesn't happen often but even in an impeccably set up system, it happens - which is why Campagnolo recommend not to do it.

It's straight geometry. If you correctly set the H screw so that on small ring to big sprocket the RD doesn't foul the biggest sprocket, you end up with too much free chain between the top jockey wheel and the smallest sprockets ... and the built-in overshift that produces a crisp, fast shift in a correctly set-up system means that with too much free chain, some of the precision is lost and an over-run can be produced. Shifting in the middle of the cassette can also be a bit flakey.

Back to my refused warranty - chain over-run and jam was exactly what happened to the customer in question, except that in his case, in a violent back-pedal in a panic to try and unjam his chain (he wasn't sure why his pedals had suddenly stopped dead), he so thouroughly demolished the rear mech that bits of it ended up in his rear wheel and took that out, along with the hanger and the dropout too ...

So yes, you can try and second-guess the guys that spend a lot of time (and a lot of your money, BTW - what do you think pays for the R and D?) designing stuff that works pretty much faultlessly if you put it together properly ... but on your own head be it, if it all goes horribly wrong.

For the customer's sake, I'm glad he wasn't in a bunch sprint when it happened - because quite apart from any injury to himself, he'd have quite a lot of pretty p*ssed-off riders after his hide as well if he'd jammed his chain solid shifting up at 60 ot 70 kmh in that scenario.
A Tech-Reps work is never done ...
Head Tech, Campagnolo main UK ASC

by Weenie


graeme_f_k
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by graeme_f_k

colnagoaddict wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:36 am
Valbrona wrote:Tried 36 sprocket with original 10 speed Record ... poor shifting on biggest sprockets and too much cross chaining.

I much prefer triples.
Yeah the 10 speed rigs I have I use a triple. Or 32 2x max. Ird made a 34 10 speed but sold out a long time ago. If you try 10 speed shimano the spacing is too far off and shifts like crap. 11speed is close enough to match using a shitmano campatible cassette with a campy drivetrain.

NoTe: you have to use the right version of 11 speed campy there are 3 generations of Campy 11 speed and none play nice with a different generation....Frieeky Italian italian engineering at its finest! Lo :D l
Not strictly true but follow these rules, set it up properly on a frame that is in-spec and it'll be a happy set up.
Caveat - pay attention to maximum / min sprocket sizes ...

SR & RE EPS - works with all 11s cranksets, best with cranksets post 2012
ATH & CH EPS - as above
SR, RE, CH pre 2015 need pre 2015 RDs, levers, FDs all matched, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chain
SR, RE, CH Post 2015 needs post 2015 RDs, levers, FDs all matched, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
ATH UltraShift will work with ATH UltraShift RDs (specifically), CH, RE, SR pre 2015, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
ATH PowerShift will work with Ath PowerShift RDs (specifically), then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
Match Potenza to Potenza, no year differences except pre-2018 LH shifter body needs changing to match HO cranks if used, then works with all cassettes, chains
Match Centaur 11 to Centaur 11, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
A Tech-Reps work is never done ...
Head Tech, Campagnolo main UK ASC

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Miller
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:54 pm
Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

Good clear guidance, thanks.

alcatraz
Posts: 1143
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

You'd better have a really solid low tolerance upper pulley in that derailleur and no play in the derailleur linkage. Otherwise the chain will do crazy things in smaller cogs.

/a

robertbb
Posts: 479
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:35 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

by robertbb

graeme_f_k wrote:
Tue Feb 27, 2018 2:59 pm
Follow these rules, set it up properly on a frame that is in-spec and it'll be a happy set up.
Caveat - pay attention to maximum / min sprocket sizes ...

SR & RE EPS - works with all 11s cranksets, best with cranksets post 2012
ATH & CH EPS - as above
SR, RE, CH pre 2015 need pre 2015 RDs, levers, FDs all matched, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chain
SR, RE, CH Post 2015 needs post 2015 RDs, levers, FDs all matched, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
ATH UltraShift will work with ATH UltraShift RDs (specifically), CH, RE, SR pre 2015, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
ATH PowerShift will work with Ath PowerShift RDs (specifically), then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
Match Potenza to Potenza, no year differences except pre-2018 LH shifter body needs changing to match HO cranks if used, then works with all cassettes, chains
Match Centaur 11 to Centaur 11, then works with all 11s cranksets, cassettes, chains
In regards to the bold font, sprocket sizes. The medium cage HO rear derailleurs say "29-32 only" on the cage. Why is this? Could a 12 - 27 or even a 12 - 25 be run? (perhaps with a different chain length)?

Thanks in advance!
It's ALL about the bike.

RobertBB's CyclePlanner Spreadsheet:
https://weightweenies.starbike.com/foru ... 8&t=152263

alcatraz
Posts: 1143
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Although it's probably not as big a problem to use it with small cassettes, the same problem could arise on the other end of the cassette.

If running big cassettes with undersized derailleurs cause the small cogs to lose precision, doing the opposite: running a small cassette with an oversized derailleur should theoretically cause a larger gap to the bigger cogs and lose precision shifting there.

/a

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