- remove dry threadlocker, apply loctite222 + hand tightening per Pinarello frame manual
- same as above but keep dry threadlocker
- dry installation with 35 nm torque per Campagnolo
- keep dry thread locker, apply lubricant and tighten with 35 nm torque
- remove dry thread locker, apply lubricant an tighten with 35 nm
Edit: I use lots of grease on the threads to help avoid seizing down the road.
That whole "preferred method of installing by hand using Loctite 222" has long since been called out, even by Campagnolo, as the "inferior method" of install. Use the torque wrench to 35Nm. The reason for that early recommendation was simply because proper cup tools were scarce at the beginning and more often than not heavy handed mechanics with awful wrenches would inevitably marr the surfaces only to have the customers go "uh... how come it's all scratched up now". And that is the only reason the "install by hand" method was preferred. And I challenge anyone to install one of the those cups by hand with all that dried threadlocker on them.
Then for actual installation I use blue Loctite liquid thread compound and the recommended high torque. Why.....because I've used blue Loctite on the drive side of Italian BB's going back many years (used to use grease on the non-drive side). The one time I used grease only on the drive side (and a lot of torque) a few months after installation I had the drive side cup work it's way out. So I have chosen to stay with a choice (blue Loctite) that has worked well over time (and creak free too).
I had a Pegoretti Responsorium with ITA SR cups. The driveside BB kept coming loose on me because of the loose bb threads (which is why I got rid of the frame)
1. Factory threadlocker +35Nm dry - came loose in the first 5 miles.
2. Factory threadlocker removed, loctite 222 with activator, 35Nm - came loose after a 30-mile ride
3. Factory threadlocker removed, loctite 242 with activator, 35Nm - also came loose but held on a bit longer.
4. Factory threadlocker removed, loctite 242 without activator, 35Nm - stayed in place for hundreds of miles until I sold the frame.
Loctite activator such as 7649 ensures loctite to dry and dry quickly, but it also compromises its breakaway strength a bit as per loctite document.
And I tried these four methods with 4 different cups. I am just anal like that:)
If your Dogma has tight bb threads, I wouldn't worry about apply extra loctite at all. However, since the factory threadlocker is so thick, and it may make it hard to thread the cup into an already tight bb shell (which may cause cross threading), I'd scrape it off with acetone and use a good quality grease of your choice. And, of course, torque it up to 35Nm
With campy's threadlocker being so thick, I didn't even realize threads were loose to begin with when I did my first install.
Regarding precession, I think it is one of the culprits for DS cup coming loose, because NDS threads were just as loose as DS threads, but it had no problem staying put. I didn't even have to use any loctite on NDS, just plain old grease. I'm not saying it's all precession to blame for, but once the cup gets slightly loose, precession will finish the job for good.
Calnago wrote:@tommasini... that was a common thing with Italian threads long ago, when bearings rolled directly against the cups that threaded into the frame. Hence the left hand thread on the drive side as in English Threaded BBs. But I've never heard of one of the newer Ultratorque type cups coming loose from "precession", the action that would unscrew the older Italian bb's. Did you experience this issue with an Ultratorque system as well. Just curious. Thx.
I'd seen others with the drive side unthreading back in the days of loose ball bearing BBs (as you specifically noted). My one bad day came up with the sealed cartridge bearing square taper version where it was suggested that the bearing forces were different than loose balls and thus no issues should arise from a greased and torqued drive side Italian BB threaded "cup". After that I've stuck with locktite just for piece of mind if anything else.
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For the record at VT, we use a solvent to spread the yellow, factory-applied thread locker over the entire length of the thread (as it is also a barrier to galvanic corrosion) and install at 35 nm. I still use a thick polythene "condom" over the cup to lessen the chances of the tool marking the surface of the cup.
Head Tech, Campagnolo main UK ASC
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