In Search Of: A sparkly drivetrain

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
BdaGhisallo
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 1:38 pm

by BdaGhisallo

Ok, so I have gone through the whole process and waxed up a few chains and I have one installed on the bike. It certainly is a lot cleaner than traditional oil lubes but it is anything but quiet. Granted, I have only turned the pedals with the bike on the workstand for ten minutes and, while there is no squeaking as you'd get from an underlubed chain, there is a lot of chain/cog meshing noise. It is loud. Is this something that will improve with a full hour or so on the bike on the road? If not, I will be back to my old lube pretty swiftly. After a full bike clean and fresh lubing of the chain, I used to not even hear my chain for a few rides.

probertsqbe
Posts: 106
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 1:27 pm

by probertsqbe

BdaGhisallo wrote:Ok, so I have gone through the whole process and waxed up a few chains and I have one installed on the bike. It certainly is a lot cleaner than traditional oil lubes but it is anything but quiet. Granted, I have only turned the pedals with the bike on the workstand for ten minutes and, while there is no squeaking as you'd get from an underlubed chain, there is a lot of chain/cog meshing noise. It is loud. Is this something that will improve with a full hour or so on the bike on the road? If not, I will be back to my old lube pretty swiftly. After a full bike clean and fresh lubing of the chain, I used to not even hear my chain for a few rides.

That was my experience with MoltenSpeedWax. I followed their instructions to the letter and gave it 3 or 4 chains. it was clean but very noisy which is why i switched back to Wet lube. 11 speed is definitely noisier than 10 speed.


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CrankAddictsRich
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by CrankAddictsRich

BdaGhisallo wrote:Ok, so I have gone through the whole process and waxed up a few chains and I have one installed on the bike. It certainly is a lot cleaner than traditional oil lubes but it is anything but quiet. Granted, I have only turned the pedals with the bike on the workstand for ten minutes and, while there is no squeaking as you'd get from an underlubed chain, there is a lot of chain/cog meshing noise. It is loud. Is this something that will improve with a full hour or so on the bike on the road? If not, I will be back to my old lube pretty swiftly. After a full bike clean and fresh lubing of the chain, I used to not even hear my chain for a few rides.


When you first put a chain on, its chattery because the chain is still tight with the wax in the links. Give it 10-15 minutes and that should all go away. I heard lots of people raving that a waxed chain was super quiet... quieter than a traditionally wet lubed chain. IMO, they're pretty even, if you're comparing it to a freshly lubed, wet lube chain. In my experience it lasts longer though, the smoothness and quietness.
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glepore
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by glepore

With 11 spd, I'm reusing a KMC link. I know its verboten. I'm small and don't worry. If I was 180 with a 380 ftp I'd think differently.
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BdaGhisallo
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 1:38 pm

by BdaGhisallo

BdaGhisallo wrote:Ok, so I have gone through the whole process and waxed up a few chains and I have one installed on the bike. It certainly is a lot cleaner than traditional oil lubes but it is anything but quiet. Granted, I have only turned the pedals with the bike on the workstand for ten minutes and, while there is no squeaking as you'd get from an underlubed chain, there is a lot of chain/cog meshing noise. It is loud. Is this something that will improve with a full hour or so on the bike on the road? If not, I will be back to my old lube pretty swiftly. After a full bike clean and fresh lubing of the chain, I used to not even hear my chain for a few rides.


Ok, so I put two hours on the bike this morning after re-waxing a chain last night. I had a closer look at the MSW site and it seems I err'ed in wiping down the chains lightly when they came out of the wax bath. So I didn't do that this time and simply hung the chain to drip dry.

Well, I can say that it's 'one and done' for me. The noise did diminish compared to my initial waxing but the whole ride it felt like my drivetrain was gunked up and the shifting was anything but crisp. I took a look when I got home and the derr pulleys were coated with waxy gunk and the chain was covered in globs of it with a good bit that had flaked off stuck to my chain stay.

Well, that experiment is done. I fully stripped the chains I had waxed in an OMS bath and then put them through the ultrasonic cleaner with more OMS and I will be reverting to the NFS lube I was using that, while not as clean to the touch as wax, is a heck of a lot quieter and better running. I'll put up with a five second wipe down of the chain after each ride to keep things clean.

C36
Posts: 223
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:24 am

by C36

The solution is to remove chain and cassette. Clean them in diesel it's the easiest. You can change diesel for a final cleanup and you directly see if you have dirt left.

Ste_S wrote:Those people taking their chains off to clean and/or wax - are you re-using quick links ? Or putting a new quick link on every time (taking it for granted we're talking 11spd chains here)


Haven't tried yet on 11sp, on 9 and 10 I have have either reused the quick link or pushed and pulled the master pin.


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AJS914
Posts: 2005
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

I can't believe how much work some of you are willing to do. I do cleaner-lube (rock n roll gold), wipe down once or twice a week. I wipe down the frame with quick detailer spray (car stuff) and my bike always looks clean with a minimum of fuss. Maybe twice a year I'll do a full wash with soap and water.

benp
Posts: 43
Joined: Fri Mar 21, 2014 4:22 pm

by benp

Waxing is not perfect, and that is coming from someone who has almost exclusively been paraffin waxing their chains for 15+ years. I except the waxy deposits on the chainstay and jockey wheels for the cleaner drivetrain that waxing gives me. I do hang my chains up to cool, but only after I have given then a wipe down with a latexed gloved hand. Wax migrates down under gravity and solidifies as the chain begins to cool leaving larger deposits towards the lower end of the hanging chain (usually inside the chainlinks). I have learnt to break my links and rotate them through a full arc (more than it would see in action) and then wipe down the chain to remove the loose scaly deposits before putting on the bike or storing. (I also check for clogged links and clean them out as necessary. This minimises the mess on the drivetrain.)


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JackRussellRacing
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Location: North Carolina, USA

by JackRussellRacing

AJS914 wrote:I can't believe how much work some of you are willing to do. I do cleaner-lube (rock n roll gold), wipe down once or twice a week. I wipe down the frame with quick detailer spray (car stuff) and my bike always looks clean with a minimum of fuss. Maybe twice a year I'll do a full wash with soap and water.



+1 on Rock-n-Roll. The longevity is pretty bad, but it keeps things clean (enough) for me.

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AJS914
Posts: 2005
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

That's what I'm talking about. Rock n' Roll also rates very highly on the lube wattage charts. The faster wax dip lubes are only faster by a tiny bit.

The longevity is pretty bad


True, but I don't mind putting it on twice a week. I use their blue stuff on my mountain bike and on my road bike in the winter.

1415chris
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Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

Tried Rock N Roll Absolute, it is extremely clean lube, but nowhere close to the proper lubes. The chain is quite noisy even submerged in this specific. Which brings it to the next "no no", quite expensive and it lasts just the fraction of time compared, again to the proper lube of the similar bottle size.
For instance, on Morgan Blue Race or Rohloff I can do about 500km on one chain lubrication (in dry), Absolute, unless somebody is experiencing hearing difficulties, to keep it reasonably quite, you have to apply it before/after every ride.

Calundann
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu May 18, 2017 8:39 pm

by Calundann

Hey everyone, joined the forum to participate specifically in this discussion!

I have also been experimenting with waxing chains (pure paraffin wax), primarily for reduced cleaning and well, a generally cleaner drivetrain. That part is definitely a succes, but lubrication.. not so much. I don't think I even managed to do 100 km before the chain developed that unmistakable dry, almost rasping sound. I have waxed that same chain a second time, and it developed similar symptoms ( again after just two rides). That degree of performance degradation is simply unacceptable.

Any suggestions as to why the performance degrades so quickly? A few notes; all rides done in dry conditions; chain, cassette and rings ultrasonically cleaned (with degreaser) before application. Shifting performance is still good, but the chain is noisy (dry sound), especially with high power output.

Appreciate your feedback!

CrankAddictsRich
Posts: 1112
Joined: Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:39 pm
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by CrankAddictsRich

Calundann wrote:Hey everyone, joined the forum to participate specifically in this discussion!

I have also been experimenting with waxing chains (pure paraffin wax), primarily for reduced cleaning and well, a generally cleaner drivetrain. That part is definitely a succes, but lubrication.. not so much. I don't think I even managed to do 100 km before the chain developed that unmistakable dry, almost rasping sound. I have waxed that same chain a second time, and it developed similar symptoms ( again after just two rides). That degree of performance degradation is simply unacceptable.

Any suggestions as to why the performance degrades so quickly? A few notes; all rides done in dry conditions; chain, cassette and rings ultrasonically cleaned (with degreaser) before application. Shifting performance is still good, but the chain is noisy (dry sound), especially with high power output.

Appreciate your feedback!


Try some wax actually developed for bike chains... molten speed wax.
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kode54
Posts: 1187
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

i've been using Molten Speed Wax for awhile now. the exception is that i add some paraffin oil so that the wax solution isn't so flaky. like others, i have a few spares ready to go if i'm in a rush, or riding back to back days.
- AX Lightness Vial EVO D + DA9150 + Enve SES 3.4 carbon hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 carbon hubs
- Parlee ESX + DA9150 + THM SRM PM + Enve SES 6.7 CK hubs
- Independent Fabrication Ti FLW + DA9100 + Enve 3.4 CK hubs

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BRM
Posts: 817
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:43 pm

by BRM

Calundann wrote:Hey everyone, joined the forum to participate specifically in this discussion!

I have also been experimenting with waxing chains (pure paraffin wax), primarily for reduced cleaning and well, a generally cleaner drivetrain. That part is definitely a succes, but lubrication.. not so much. I don't think I even managed to do 100 km before the chain developed that unmistakable dry, almost rasping sound. I have waxed that same chain a second time, and it developed similar symptoms ( again after just two rides). That degree of performance degradation is simply unacceptable.

Any suggestions as to why the performance degrades so quickly? A few notes; all rides done in dry conditions; chain, cassette and rings ultrasonically cleaned (with degreaser) before application. Shifting performance is still good, but the chain is noisy (dry sound), especially with high power output.

Appreciate your feedback!




Hi, People put PTFE (Teflon) or MoS2 (molybdenum disulfide) or graphite in it. As you can read in this topic
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=139970
From memory There must be other topics too with discussions about wax and additives.

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