Sagan's new disc ride....

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
L3X
Posts: 290
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:39 pm

by L3X

Here's some guessitmates:

Frame: Specialized S-Works Venge ViAS disc, size 56: 1170 (actual 56cm project black disc frame)
Fork: Specialized S-Works Venge ViAS disc fork: 410 (actual 56cm project black disc frame)
Stem: Venge ViAS aero stem, 150mm: 150
Handlebar: S-Works Aerofly carbon: 250
Front brake: Shimano R-785 disc, 160mm rotor: 1000
Rear brake: Shimano R-785 disc, 140mm rotor 0
Front derailleur: Shimano Dura-Ace Di2: 140
Rear derailleur: Shimano Dura-Ace Di2: 214
Cassette: Shimano Dura-Ace, 11-28T: 176
Chain: Shimano Dura-Ace 11 speed: 250
Crankset: Shimano Dura-Ace, 172.5mm, 53/39T: 640
Pedals: Shimano Dura-Ace: 250
Wheelset: Roval CLX 64mm: 1375
Tyres: S-Works Turbo Cotton 26mm: 500
Saddle: S-Works Romin Evo: 135
Seatpost: Specialized Venge, FACT carbon: 210 (actual 56cm project black disc frame)
Bottle cages: Tacx Deva carbon: 50
Battery/wires etc.: 200

Random stuff I missed (~5%): 356 (i.e. headset stuff, BB etc.)

Total guesstimate: 7476
Total Sagan's bike: 8460
Random stuff on Sagan's bike: 984

One way or another, those wheels and the paint on the bike must weigh a ton. Honestly I dont understand why they don't put him on a Project black paint scheme frame and normal wheels, that way you can get the weight down towards 7.2/7.3 pretty easily which is on par with for instance the new aeroad disc.

MoPho
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Location: NorCal/SoCal

by MoPho

peted76 wrote: There always seems to be someone who turns up a club bash on an old steel heavy clunker unoiled and grimy who'll still beat the young whippets :)



There is a older guy in the South Bay of Los Angeles that regularly beats the pants off really strong younger guys on big dollar road bikes on the local big climb that everyone challenges themselves on. He does this while riding a really heavy beat up old big box store mountain bike while wearing cutoff jeans, leather work boots, and no shirt. He is known as "shirtless Keith". Apparently he rides around 400 miles a week :shock:



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Asteroid
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Location: Los Angeles, California

by Asteroid

MoPho wrote:
peted76 wrote: There always seems to be someone who turns up a club bash on an old steel heavy clunker unoiled and grimy who'll still beat the young whippets :)



There is a older guy in the South Bay of Los Angeles that regularly beats the pants off really strong younger guys on big dollar road bikes on the local big climb that everyone challenges themselves on. He does this while riding a really heavy beat up old big box store mountain bike while wearing cutoff jeans, leather work boots, and no shirt. He is known as "shirtless Keith". Apparently he rides around 400 miles a week :shock:



love it! Makes me wonder if it's the same dude that spanked everybody uphill on the Rosarito-Ensenada 50-miler twenty years ago. That rider looked like his early-20's back then. Rode a beach cruiser in flipflops, passing scores of cyclists (including me!) up the long 6% grade midway thru. Really amazing.
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thedonnydino
Posts: 84
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2016 11:10 pm

by thedonnydino

My understanding is that a lot of the weight is going to be either in the frame or discs. Frame weight and rotational weight along the axle is less of an issue than rotational weight along the outside edge of the rim.

For those playing at home, it would be cheaper and healthier losing a kilo or two from around the waistline.

This doesn't take into account any gains from the aero properties of the bike.

Having said that, professional cyclists are in optimal shape and on strict diets. Marginal gains are important to them. Accordingly, I don't see GC contenders actively choosing to ride this bike up any mountain.

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LeDuke
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Location: Front Range, CO

by LeDuke

Probably not. But if you could build a 6.8kg Tarmac with discs and 25mm tubeless tires using the new Specialized 50mm disc clinchers, that would be an amazing bike for getting up AND down the mountains.

As we've seen in recent years, races are often lost on descents. As are stage victories.



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L3X
Posts: 290
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:39 pm

by L3X

thedonnydino wrote:Marginal gains are important to them. Accordingly, I don't see GC contenders actively choosing to ride this bike up any mountain.

My point exactly, why would you want to take all this paint with you?

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Calnago
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by Calnago

LeDuke wrote:Probably not. But if you could build a 6.8kg Tarmac with discs and 25mm tubeless tires using the new Specialized 50mm disc clinchers, that would be an amazing bike for getting up AND down the mountains.

As we've seen in recent years, races are often lost on descents. As are stage victories.

Barring a race ending crash, have any Grand Tours ever been lost while descending?
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thedonnydino
Posts: 84
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by thedonnydino

The logic starts to get into grey territory though when you try and substantiate the weight gain vs the reported aero gains.

It then becomes entirely subjective based on a whole range of factors outside of simple laboratory experiments in front of a wind tunnel.

In my opinion, ride what you think is cool.

I think this is a cool looking bike with some interesting engineering features. Likewise, I think some of the beautifully engineered featherweight bikes on this forum are equally as cool.

I think we're trying to rationalise the performance of this bike, but I really, really don't think we will be able to reach any meaningful conclusion.

It's still fun discussing it though!

thedonnydino
Posts: 84
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2016 11:10 pm

by thedonnydino

Calnago wrote:
LeDuke wrote:Probably not. But if you could build a 6.8kg Tarmac with discs and 25mm tubeless tires using the new Specialized 50mm disc clinchers, that would be an amazing bike for getting up AND down the mountains.

As we've seen in recent years, races are often lost on descents. As are stage victories.

Barring a race ending crash, have any Grand Tours ever been lost while descending?


I think some Grand Tours and classic races have been won descending. Cadel Evans and Nibali were both able to put some decent time on their opponents in recent tours, and Froome's surprise descent early in the piece last year was demoralising for his opponents IMO.

MRM
Posts: 349
Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 8:15 pm

by MRM

Calnago wrote:
LeDuke wrote:Probably not. But if you could build a 6.8kg Tarmac with discs and 25mm tubeless tires using the new Specialized 50mm disc clinchers, that would be an amazing bike for getting up AND down the mountains.

As we've seen in recent years, races are often lost on descents. As are stage victories.

Barring a race ending crash, have any Grand Tours ever been lost while descending?


Kruijswijk lost the last Giro to Nibali due to a crash while descending.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Those guys all go uphill better than they go down... well... Nibali can pretty much do it all. I would argue that Grand Tours are won going up, as opposed to being lost going down. And as awe inspiring as it is to watch guys like Cancellara and Sagan descending at the limit, I don't think any of the GC contenders are too worried about guys like that stealing their overall status. But I see your point, that if two GC contenders are neck and neck, cresting that final climb at the same time, then may the best descender reach the bottom first. But unless that finish line is pretty close to the bottom, chances are slim that the race will be lost due to what happens on the descent, but yes, anything can happen.
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spartan
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by spartan

do you guys remember the RIO olympic road race. both female/male races were lost on the descent.
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antonioiglesius
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:08 pm

by antonioiglesius

Peter's cool but I think the gold rims are pushing it...

Image


The first thing I thought of when I saw the mountain bike was "electric bike".

Nefarious86
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by Nefarious86

So they build up a blingged out Disc ViAS as a marketing tool to gain attention and automatically the respnse here is "zomg its to heavy to be raced and impractical yada yada..."

Its a marketing stunt, not a race bike. He uses the rim brake version to race on and will still have a Tarmac ready for days he wants to ride it.

There are ViAS's here owned by forum members that are lighter than some of the bikes the pro's run... But hey, can't stand in the way of a good old WW one eyed bent out of shape cry baby circle jerk...
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superdx
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by superdx

thedonnydino wrote:Having said that, professional cyclists are in optimal shape and on strict diets. Marginal gains are important to them. Accordingly, I don't see GC contenders actively choosing to ride this bike up any mountain.


This is probably the most truth in any WW discussion. Try a strict diet for 3 weeks. You will be amazed at how much weight you lose and how much fitness you gain. Pro cyclists don't get cheat days. Every day is 100% game on including Sat+Sun.

At home, with no guidance or someone watching your activity, you are going to fall off the wagon and it's also very hard to stay motivated. Which is why diets are the hardest things to do by yourself.

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