Chain lubricants

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Cannoli
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2020 1:53 pm
Location: Mid-Atlantic, USA

by Cannoli

FYSA: I've been riding on a new DA chain that was cleaned in an ultrasonic cleaner, then treated with AB GRAPHEN wax. As of today, I'm at 241km and just applied a top-off of UFO drip due to more noise than I prefer. All 241km were ridden in dry, clean (non-dusty) conditions.

The short of it, even AB GRAPHEN wax has a shorter life-expectancy than advertised. Additionally, I'm very happy with UFO drip, but do need to apply it more frequently than advertised.
Canyon Aeroad CFR Di2 | Canyon Ultimate SLX 9.0 Di2 | Trek Domane SL5 Disc (Gravel Bike / Fly-Away Road Bike) | Orbea Tera H-30 Disc (Touring Bike)

jencvo
Posts: 325
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:01 pm

by jencvo

rides4beer wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:49 pm
Torbjorn wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:00 am
How are the noise levels from the new Silca Super Secret chain lube?
I'm curious about this as well. Thinking about trying it, but above all else, it has to be quiet. I can't stand any noise from my drivetrain. :lol:
It's not silent for me and I keep thinking I need to add more lube but then I run my fingers across the chain and there's no gunk but I can feel its smooth and not bare metal, so I'm guessing still ok? It's so hard to tell for me so I aim to relube more often than not. Hoping Tobin or somebody with few thousand miles can chime in on this because I'm curious on proper relubing intervals

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HammerTime2
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Location: Wherever there's a mountain beckoning to be climbed

by HammerTime2

UFO Drip Chain Coating - FAQ video
UFO Drip new formula:

How long does each application last?

Each chain coating for UFO Drip is going to give you around 300 km, or 180 miles, of high efficiency, stable, continued use. After the first 50 to 80 km, or about 30 plus miles, you may notice that the chain wax on the surface has already depleted a bit. This is totally normal from friction on the surface of the chain. You still have adequate chain wax down inside the chain links and rollers, giving high performance, and that market leading efficiency you know and expect from UFO Drip.
,,,

Why do we need to wait after applying UFO Drip?

We want to allow that wax content to totally solidify and dry inside the rollers and links, as well as on the surface of the chain. This is going to give the best performance for efficiency, as well as giving the best cleanliness over time.
...

Should I wipe the chain down after applying UFO Drip?

No. We want to leave that wax on the surface of the chain to help protect the chain and give the best durability and longevity possible. The wax on the surface will dry overnight, and this is going to give you a nice, dry, non-tacky surface, and that sets you up for success and long-term durability.

UFO Drip New and Improved Formula - Application video
Once you've applied UFO Drip fully on the chain, you can go ahead and let dry. You do not need to wipe off. You want to leave that surface wax to dry on the chain to help protect it and give a nice dry surface finish.

AMGRoadster
Posts: 274
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:57 am

by AMGRoadster

Cannoli wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:29 pm
FYSA: I've been riding on a new DA chain that was cleaned in an ultrasonic cleaner, then treated with AB GRAPHEN wax. As of today, I'm at 241km and just applied a top-off of UFO drip due to more noise than I prefer. All 241km were ridden in dry, clean (non-dusty) conditions.

The short of it, even AB GRAPHEN wax has a shorter life-expectancy than advertised. Additionally, I'm very happy with UFO drip, but do need to apply it more frequently than advertised.
Not trying to sound like a dick but 241km is at most 2 days of riding for me. If something is only reliable for...lets say 500km...it is still to much of a time investment for me. I want the best but at a reasonable effort level. 500km is at best 1 week of riding for me.

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xplaza
Posts: 104
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 11:19 am

by xplaza

Has the Muc-Off C3 dry ceramic ever been tested? I like how easy it cleans

talltales
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Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:43 pm

by talltales

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Wed Mar 03, 2021 10:21 am
wltz wrote:
Wed Mar 03, 2021 9:18 am
Am I the only one to notice that the new UFO Drip only lasts about 150k max in dry weather? I am using it on a previously MSW-waxed chain as a top up and find it frustrating to need to reapply so often considering the cost per application?

Are you basing this off chain chatter or squeaks? UFO Drip doesn't do much in the way of damping chatter. As long as your chain doesn't miss shifts and doesn't squeak, the lube is still working just fine.
How do you know?

Sounds like a claim pulled from thin air. Was it?

That said im thinking along those lines too. You may not be able to judge if the lube still works based on sound, except if its squeaking.

Im trying old school MC chain melt wax from an old Castroll tin. Seems to work well, but the chain chatters more now, after 150 km, than just after application. But i have a hard time believing MC chain wax would only last 150km/100mi, that is easily less than one day on a MC.

okx
Posts: 169
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:06 am

by okx

xplaza wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:00 am
Has the Muc-Off C3 dry ceramic ever been tested? I like how easy it cleans
I'm using muc-off c3 dry for last 2-3 years. in dry it works for 200-300km. If you will get in to a rain it will be cleaned quite quickly.
For cleaning chain, also quite good with muc-off degreaser and park-tool cyclone CM-5.2.
sram red chain was much quieter with this lube comparing to squirt. for campy 12speed - no difference, regarding chain noise.
Now i've ordered to try muc-off hydrodinamic lube, very interested how it will work.

TobinHatesYou
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by TobinHatesYou

okx wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:08 am

I'm using muc-off c3 dry for last 2-3 years. in dry it works for 200-300km. If you will get in to a rain it will be cleaned quite quickly.
For cleaning chain, also quite good with muc-off degreaser and park-tool cyclone CM-5.2.
sram red chain was much quieter with this lube comparing to squirt. for campy 12speed - no difference, regarding chain noise.
Now i've ordered to try muc-off hydrodinamic lube, very interested how it will work.

According to Adam Kerin at Zero Friction Cycling, Muc-Off Hydrodynamic is one of the worst lubes he's ever tested.

His reviews are impossible to read, so I'll just quote his conclusions.
ZFC Overall Performance Ratings

Race Day Lubricant Road – 1/10
Its outright efficiency even on a perfectly clean chain is quite low at 6.25w – not unexpected for a lubricant of this
viscosity, but not a match for the marketing claims. The clean block 1 wear rate however shows that it would quickly
deteriorate to losses much higher than this. It recorded a notably higher wear rate that white lightning epic ride which was
the lowest efficiency lubricant FF ever tested at 9w on clean chain, and Epic Ride rather obviously has little actual lubricant
vs carrier fluid hence its very high wear rate for clean block one. For Team Sky Hydrodynamic to record a higher wear rate
= highest friction real world lubricant tested to date.

Race Day Lubricant - MTB / CX – 0/10
It may cling onto your chain, but it also clings onto every particle of dust and grit and becomes liquid sandpaper in record
time. Wear rates were astounding.

Everyday Lubricant – 0/10
Expensive, horrendously mess, very high parts wear rate.

Harsh Conditions Lubricant – 0/10
It simply does not matter that it is Hydrodynamic and will not be washed off in harsh conditions. What is staying on is
providing you with the highest friction performance you are likely to find.

Single Application for Long event – 0/10
As above. Based on wear rates from block 1 & 2 it was not warrant cost of testing in single application longevity test.

okx
Posts: 169
Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:06 am

by okx

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:51 am
okx wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:08 am

I'm using muc-off c3 dry for last 2-3 years. in dry it works for 200-300km. If you will get in to a rain it will be cleaned quite quickly.
For cleaning chain, also quite good with muc-off degreaser and park-tool cyclone CM-5.2.
sram red chain was much quieter with this lube comparing to squirt. for campy 12speed - no difference, regarding chain noise.
Now i've ordered to try muc-off hydrodinamic lube, very interested how it will work.

According to Adam Kerin at Zero Friction Cycling, Muc-Off Hydrodynamic is one of the worst lubes he's ever tested.

His reviews are impossible to read, so I'll just quote his conclusions.
ZFC Overall Performance Ratings

Race Day Lubricant Road – 1/10
Its outright efficiency even on a perfectly clean chain is quite low at 6.25w – not unexpected for a lubricant of this
viscosity, but not a match for the marketing claims. The clean block 1 wear rate however shows that it would quickly
deteriorate to losses much higher than this. It recorded a notably higher wear rate that white lightning epic ride which was
the lowest efficiency lubricant FF ever tested at 9w on clean chain, and Epic Ride rather obviously has little actual lubricant
vs carrier fluid hence its very high wear rate for clean block one. For Team Sky Hydrodynamic to record a higher wear rate
= highest friction real world lubricant tested to date.

Race Day Lubricant - MTB / CX – 0/10
It may cling onto your chain, but it also clings onto every particle of dust and grit and becomes liquid sandpaper in record
time. Wear rates were astounding.

Everyday Lubricant – 0/10
Expensive, horrendously mess, very high parts wear rate.

Harsh Conditions Lubricant – 0/10
It simply does not matter that it is Hydrodynamic and will not be washed off in harsh conditions. What is staying on is
providing you with the highest friction performance you are likely to find.

Single Application for Long event – 0/10
As above. Based on wear rates from block 1 & 2 it was not warrant cost of testing in single application longevity test.
Until I haven't got it and tested, can't comment on this.
But from my expirience, more than 50+% depends on how lube was applyed.
I have a friend, who last year used muc-off c3 dry lube in spain training camp and what he said - worst lube what he have used.
After some time, he used it again, but this time following my recommendations and it worked perfectly.

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Cannoli
Posts: 533
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2020 1:53 pm
Location: Mid-Atlantic, USA

by Cannoli

AMGRoadster wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:20 am
Cannoli wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:29 pm
FYSA: I've been riding on a new DA chain that was cleaned in an ultrasonic cleaner, then treated with AB GRAPHEN wax. As of today, I'm at 241km and just applied a top-off of UFO drip due to more noise than I prefer. All 241km were ridden in dry, clean (non-dusty) conditions.

The short of it, even AB GRAPHEN wax has a shorter life-expectancy than advertised. Additionally, I'm very happy with UFO drip, but do need to apply it more frequently than advertised.
Not trying to sound like a dick but 241km is at most 2 days of riding for me. If something is only reliable for...lets say 500km...it is still to much of a time investment for me. I want the best but at a reasonable effort level. 500km is at best 1 week of riding for me.
On the weekends, that IS two days of riding for me. The point of the post is the AB wax does NOT last as long as they say it is supposed to, even when the miles were under "ideal" conditions.

I know some say chain noise is not the indicator of wax lubricant breakdown, but I can't stand riding with a noisy chain.
Canyon Aeroad CFR Di2 | Canyon Ultimate SLX 9.0 Di2 | Trek Domane SL5 Disc (Gravel Bike / Fly-Away Road Bike) | Orbea Tera H-30 Disc (Touring Bike)

Torbjorn
Posts: 176
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:44 pm

by Torbjorn

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:51 am
His reviews are impossible to read, so I'll just quote his conclusions.
Oh god, yes. He might be good at testing chain lubricants, but he can't organize his thoughts or write for shit.

twoangstroms
Posts: 463
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:49 am

by twoangstroms

Just to add an experience-based data point on Rock and Roll Gold (caveat: on a chain y'all would have replaced maybe a year ago, and one that I'd previously been using Pro Gold on, which felt great and lasted in all sorts of conditions but your chain would be black after one ride and cleaning it meant a lot of gunk).

I've been putting in about 350k a week, a mix of outdoor and indoor, because I can afford to be a weather weenie lately. I reapply and wipe Rock and Roll Gold maybe one a week or two -- I can invest the maybe minute that involves.

What I can't figure out is how my chain picks up dirt from days of indoor riding. (I clean my apartment often.)

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NoPasaran
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:41 pm
Location: Switzerland

by NoPasaran

okx wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:09 am

....
Until I haven't got it and tested, can't comment on this.
But from my expirience, more than 50+% depends on how lube was applyed.
I have a friend, who last year used muc-off c3 dry lube in spain training camp and what he said - worst lube what he have used.
After some time, he used it again, but this time following my recommendations and it worked perfectly.
and what ARE your recommendations?
2021 Cube Litening C68x SL Red&Black
2018 S-Works Tarmac SL6 Superstar

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12457
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

twoangstroms wrote:
Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:06 pm

What I can't figure out is how my chain picks up dirt from days of indoor riding. (I clean my apartment often.)

It’s probably not dirt, but the remaining carrier/solvent that hasn’t evaporated and micro particles of worn off chain/chainring/cog turning your cleaning rag black.

by Weenie


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twoangstroms
Posts: 463
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:49 am

by twoangstroms

Thanks -- that's true. I've opened up my trainer to get at some squeaks and I'm definitely contributing to some elements in there returning to the earth (I mean, there's fine granular wear).

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