Colnago C59 tyre clearance?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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Calnago
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by Calnago

It's not the width that's a problem on a C59. It's the height, particularly underneath the fork crown. New 2014 C59 forks are fine. Same as C60. I have some Conti 25mm competitions mounted on Nemesis rims. Same clearance as the 25mm Veloflex Arenebergs or Roubaixs. Tubulars are constrained by the tire casing versus clinchers which can vary a fair bit in height depending on the rim they're mounted on.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
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GonaSovereign
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by GonaSovereign

It's all rather odd. On my older EPS, I have quite a bit more clearance running 25mm VIttorias on Zipp 101s, and of course tons running 25 on Shimano c-24. I wouldn't have thought they'd reduce clearance on newer models.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

I guess you'd have to try it. I have no clearance problems at all on my C50. I even fitted some full fenders to it one winter (albeit with 23mm tires). But both my C59 and EPQ have VERY tight clearance with a 25mm tubular, both in Veloflex and Continental. It's doable but I wouldn't want to ride any chip seal with it. Yet some here are claiming they have scads of clearance, the largest being like 10mm with a 25mm Roubaix. I could see maybe a couple mm of variance (not sure how the forks are manufactured) but certainly no 10mm. Let me know what kind of clearance you had on yours if you get a chance to test it. I just got the last four 24mm Roubaixs from World Class Cycles so I'll be good for now. Anyone want some new unglued 25mm Veloflex Roubaix and Arenbergs?
Keep in mind that when the C59 was launched 25mm wide tires were just barely being talked about on a high end road bike. At that time the standard for road bike tire clearance was a 23mm tire and wide rims weren't really much of a factor either. Also, that doesn't mean that older bikes had less clearance than new bikes. It is true that is the case with a lot of carbon forks up until recently, but there are a lot of steel race bikes etc that have tons of clearance for fat tires. Things have changed a lot since those days. Much more to think about when you're doing a build these days.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

RobertsColnago
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by RobertsColnago

I have a 2014 C59 (one of the last one's produced, with the electronic and mechanical gear compatibility), and I am using Shamals with 25mm Continental GP4000s2 tyres, and clearance is VERY tight (I'm not convinced that the later C59's have more clearance, if I'm honest).
I tried the 1.5mm allen key, and it's too tight to fit between the tyre and fork crown (but I have 0.2mm 3M ScotchCal paint protector tape under there as well) . I tried it with a 1.3mm key, and that JUST fits, so without the paint protector (which I replace every couple of rides because it gets scratched away), that would be 1.5mm clearance.
Interestingly, the clearance for the rear wheel/tyre is EXACTLY the same (so I use 3M ScotchCal under there as well), and the Campy SR brakes are so close to the tyre that the paint on the outside arm gets chipped with larger stones.

It's the only "fault" I can find with the bike, otherwise it's perfect, but one of the reasons I'm thinking about getting the Colnago Prestige cyclo-cross frame (that has BAGS of tyre clearance!).

Bob.
Chas Roberts Custom mountain bike.
2014 Colnago C59.

enr1co
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by enr1co

RobertsColnago wrote:I have a 2014 C59 (one of the last one's produced, with the electronic and mechanical gear compatibility), and I am using Shamals with 25mm Continental GP4000s2 tyres, and clearance is VERY tight (I'm not convinced that the later C59's have more clearance, if I'm honest).
I tried the 1.5mm allen key, and it's too tight to fit between the tyre and fork crown (but I have 0.2mm 3M ScotchCal paint protector tape under there as well) . I tried it with a 1.3mm key, and that JUST fits, so without the paint protector (which I replace every couple of rides because it gets scratched away), that would be 1.5mm clearance.
Interestingly, the clearance for the rear wheel/tyre is EXACTLY the same (so I use 3M ScotchCal under there as well), and the Campy SR brakes are so close to the tyre that the paint on the outside arm gets chipped with larger stones.

It's the only "fault" I can find with the bike, otherwise it's perfect.


Also, have a 2014 C59. Just picked up a minty Enve 3.4 Smart set, added some new Conti GP4000S 25mm and as Bob states "VERY tight". Experienced noise and scratches from just testing out the new wheelset/tires on the street in front of the house. Likely will go back to mounting some 23 mm or small 25 mm tires (like Veloflexes) as Id rather not have to worry about the inside of my fork getting eaten up.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Robert and @enr1co: From what you both say I'd say you both have the added clearance of the newer fork, which as you've noted, still isn't that much. With a 25mm Continental 4000sII on a standard width Campy Neutron rim mounted in my pre 2014 Colnagos, the tire will spin, but that's it. There is virtually no daylight between the fork crown and the top of the tire. Less than 0.5mm for sure. I wouldn't ride it on mine. And Robert, the fact that you seem to have "some" clearance kind of makes me think you've got the newer fork, but it's still mounted on a standard width rim, right?... so I'm not as sure. Do you have pic of the fork? I could tell from that.
@Enr1co: You must have the 2014 added clearance if a 25mm 4000S on an Enve 3.4 front rim will even spin. That combination would not even be able to fit in my dropouts without being jammed by the fork crown.

This is a bit of an issue to think about with wider rims on bikes with minimal clearance if you want to run bigger tires as well. A 23mm clincher on a wider rim will sit higher than the exact same tire on a "normal" width rim because the beads are more spread out to begin with all else being equal. Of course the manufacturers will say a 23mm rides the same on a wider rim as a 25mm on a normal rim. So what, that's just a dumb statement in my opinion. They're comparing apples and oranges. Maybe I just want to run a 25mm tire on a wide rim. Most of this applies to clinchers I might add. With tubulars, which I run, the tire size is held in place by the casing. I've had both 25mm Veloflex and Conti tubulars and can run them in my frames, but it's tighter than I'd like it to be, for sure.

I'm in the process of looking out for a "rain frame" that I can mount full fenders on with some decent clearance. I did manage to (with a lot of dremelling) get a pair of full fenders on my C50 one year but could only run 23's and even then the noise and chatter from so little clearance was very annoying. The Trek Domane may be my best bet and I will be testing one out in the near future. Earlier this week I spent an afternoon on a Giant Defy with disc brakes and that bike was very smooth, but the geometry didn't suit me. I don't want a cyclocross frame with fenders as I don't like the handling on the road. Basically I'm in search of a bike that I don't feel I'm sacrificing ride and handling characteristics with, except for it having full fenders. An elusive beast so far. A friend has a Tarmac that seems to have loads of clearance should I want to add fenders and I'm looking into that as well as it's geometry in a 58 is very very close to my Colnago 61 traditional.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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ianSWBB
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by ianSWBB

2014 C59

The first batches had the standard C59 fork from the previous years (very tight with a 25mm tyre)

The later batches came with what was to be the C60 fork (OK with a 25mm tyre)

Also, to confirm what others have said, different tyres come up with different profiles - one of the tightest/smallest profiles are the Michelin Pro4 range - so if struggling for space, try one of these :)

regards
ianSWBB

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Yes. that makes sense with what I've seen... Even though it's a 2014, there may be some that came with the older fork. However... have you tried a 25mm Conti 4000S on an Enve Smart rim up front, even with the new fork. I think you'll find the same as @enr1co, which is that it's very very tight. And like I said, that combo won't even fit in a pre "later 2014 fork" (same as C60 fork). Too bad. Still... wouldn't trade my Colnagos because of that.

So, if you want to run wider rims with a 25mm tire, be wary and choose carefully, even if it's a C60.

I found that a 25mm clincher on a normal width rim fits in the new fork about the same as a 23mm clincher on a normal width rim did in the older fork. About the same clearance in each scenario.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

sastre
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Location: uk/ Essex

by sastre

Image

27mm fmb roubaix and a 25 roughly the same as veloflex and vittora front has about the same clearance as calnago 10mm thats a lie or a big exaggeration. :noidea: c59 2011-2012

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fa63
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by fa63

ianSWBB wrote:2014 C59
one of the tightest/smallest profiles are the Michelin Pro4 range - so if struggling for space, try one of these :)

regards
ianSWBB


My Pro4 25mm tires measure 28mm on non-wide rims. I have seen a few reports suggesting the same as well.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Next time I work on my friend's 2014 C59 (with the C60 fork) I'll get some pics showing the clearance there with similar tires... 23mm, 25mm, tubulars, and clinchers.
I am running 25mm Arenbergs on Bora Ultra Two's. The clearance is very tight but it doesn't touch, just every little thing the tires pick gets jammed through there. Not a big issue on clean dry roads, but I don't always ride on clean dry roads... So, I have the 24mm Veloflex Roubaixs that are a perfect size for this frame. Adequate clearance and a nice stable ride.

@Sastre, yes that rear clearance is the same as mine, but it's the clearance under the fork that is my main issue with 25mm tires.
@fa63, it's more the height of the tire profile that is the issue as opposed to the width. Plenty of clearance width wise.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

RobertsColnago
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by RobertsColnago

Calnago wrote:Robert and @enr1co: From what you both say I'd say you both have the added clearance of the newer fork, which as you've noted, still isn't that much. With a 25mm Continental 4000sII on a standard width Campy Neutron rim mounted in my pre 2014 Colnagos, the tire will spin, but that's it. There is virtually no daylight between the fork crown and the top of the tire. Less than 0.5mm for sure. I wouldn't ride it on mine. And Robert, the fact that you seem to have "some" clearance kind of makes me think you've got the newer fork, but it's still mounted on a standard width rim, right?... so I'm not as sure. Do you have pic of the fork? I could tell from that.


Here are pictures of the fork, and the clearance. The rim is a standard Campag Shamal rim, with an outside (braking surface) width of 21mm.
The rear tyre clearance is just as bad as the front.
Bob.

Just realised, as a new member, I can't post pictures, so here are links;

http://s1153.photobucket.com/user/BobCanon7D/media/Colnago/IMG_1296_zpsa02c8e1a.jpg.html
http://s1153.photobucket.com/user/BobCanon7D/media/Colnago/IMG_1299_zpsa0b7c15d.jpg.html
Chas Roberts Custom mountain bike.
2014 Colnago C59.

Harmitc
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Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:56 pm

by Harmitc

Sorry for being off topic, but why did you leave the shipping bungs on the threads of the cable adjusters? If I've looked at your pictures correctly!

RobertsColnago
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by RobertsColnago

Harmitc wrote:Sorry for being off topic, but why did you leave the shipping bungs on the threads of the cable adjusters? If I've looked at your pictures correctly!


Good spot!
I actually drilled a hole in the bungs for the inner cables, and they help to keep the dust and moisture out of the cables. It seemed a shame to simply throw them away, when they could be put to good use. It doesn't affect the braking at all.

Bob.
Chas Roberts Custom mountain bike.
2014 Colnago C59.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Robert, you have the pre-C60 fork. It's exactly the same as mine. Same clearance, etc. I'm calling it the "pre C60" fork because some 2014 C59's have the C60 fork with a little more clearance, and some don't.
And yes... That packing bung on the brake cable needs to go. :)
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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