Hongfu FM-066/Chinese open mould frame thread

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
ZachUA
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:39 pm

by ZachUA

Hey guys, I am trying to find which asian manufacturer/open mold frame these are coming from.

If it is open mold, it should be available unbranded somewhere? I don't see if listed on any of the sellers like Dengfu or Hongfu (fm015 looks similar but seat stays are very different), nor can I find it on any of the other common direct from manufacturer sites. Does anyone have an idea who is the true manufacturer of this frame? Any other frames out there that match this one being sold under different brand? I've read element six is same but it looks slightly different to me. Pedal Force doesn't have my size and they don't plan on restocking the QS3 anymore (per email with PF a few months ago).

Examples, Kyklos Featherweight vs Ritte Bosberg:
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

The seat stay junction appears dead match for Ritte/Kyklos. You can see that sometimes the cables are mounted external and other times internal but otherwise the frames appear same. I believe the first versions were external while later internal.

Ritte's geo chart even looks similar to one of the pics from the Chinese manufacturers:
Image

User avatar
prendrefeu
Posts: 8609
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:32 pm
Location: Los Feliz, Los Angeles, California
Contact:

by prendrefeu

They are not open mold, but the brands have not developed the molds either. ;)

From this thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=113717&p=1023878#p1023878

prendrefeu wrote:Open-mould refers to a frame/set that is available through several vendors. Think of it like "open source" software.
Non-open-mould refers to a frame/set that is either proprietary to a specific brand, or a frame design that is specifically sourced to brands from design firms.

Examples of the latter can be Edge Design, Axman, and a whole lot of other frames that you may or may not hear about since you aren't a manufacturer or brand.
These design firms rarely, if ever, sell their frames to consumers. The only chance to get those is through a purchase of a sample frame through a brand that ordered one. Very, very rarely one may show up on a marketplace such as eBay or CL, or wherever, and these are usually a sample that was passed down the line from a brand after they finished their evaluation.

If a brand (particularly those that are starting off) is unable to hire their own designers and engineers, they will source this skill from a design firm.
Sometimes an upcoming brand can't afford a design firm, so they will source from an open-mould vendor instead and give it a paint job.
Examples of this: Ritte's Bosberg, PedalForce frames, and as we saw at the most recent Eurobike even some slightly-more established brands are sourcing open-mould TT frames.

Examples of the 'open-mould' frames can be found through common vendors, such as Hong-Fu, Deng-Fu, Flyxii, etc:.


BTW - Many of the brands you mentioned, especially Ritte, will claim immediately "We worked with the manufacturer to perfect the geometries" or "design" or whatever. They're bullshitting you to what extent you want to believe the phrase "worked with" to develop "their own" whatever. The design firms give options, you as a brand check off the boxes. That's as far as it goes, really. They won't make a certain geo longer or shorter for a particular brand because that would mean a whole new mold, which if these guys could afford in the first place they wouldn't be using these types of frames.
Exp001 || Other projects in the works.

ZachUA
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 5:39 pm

by ZachUA

prendrefeu wrote:They are not open mold, but the brands have not developed the molds either. ;)

From this thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=113717&p=1023878#p1023878

prendrefeu wrote:Open-mould refers to a frame/set that is available through several vendors. Think of it like "open source" software.
Non-open-mould refers to a frame/set that is either proprietary to a specific brand, or a frame design that is specifically sourced to brands from design firms.

Examples of the latter can be Edge Design, Axman, and a whole lot of other frames that you may or may not hear about since you aren't a manufacturer or brand.
These design firms rarely, if ever, sell their frames to consumers. The only chance to get those is through a purchase of a sample frame through a brand that ordered one. Very, very rarely one may show up on a marketplace such as eBay or CL, or wherever, and these are usually a sample that was passed down the line from a brand after they finished their evaluation.

If a brand (particularly those that are starting off) is unable to hire their own designers and engineers, they will source this skill from a design firm.
Sometimes an upcoming brand can't afford a design firm, so they will source from an open-mould vendor instead and give it a paint job.
Examples of this: Ritte's Bosberg, PedalForce frames, and as we saw at the most recent Eurobike even some slightly-more established brands are sourcing open-mould TT frames.

Examples of the 'open-mould' frames can be found through common vendors, such as Hong-Fu, Deng-Fu, Flyxii, etc:.


BTW - Many of the brands you mentioned, especially Ritte, will claim immediately "We worked with the manufacturer to perfect the geometries" or "design" or whatever. They're bullshitting you to what extent you want to believe the phrase "worked with" to develop "their own" whatever. The design firms give options, you as a brand check off the boxes. That's as far as it goes, really. They won't make a certain geo longer or shorter for a particular brand because that would mean a whole new mold, which if these guys could afford in the first place they wouldn't be using these types of frames.


Awesome bit of info. Thank you for sharing! I am still trying to wrap my head around the difference. So even though Ritte, Kyklos, and Pedal Force are selling what appears to be the same frame, it is not open mold...but it is also not available to anyone/everyone? Essentially Ritte does not own the mold and neither does Kyklos but rather both have hired the same design firm to create a frame for them from a stock set of options? If so, wouldn't this design firm own the mold and the ability to resell the same frame with no branding?

User avatar
DMF
Posts: 1062
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:14 am
Location: Sweden

by DMF

They could but they don't. It is their choice.

User avatar
Elrey
Posts: 563
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:13 pm
Location: Denmark. Yeeees

by Elrey

Image

I saw this frame today from Deng-fu.
Nice finish, but the bb30 box didn't have a "stopper" for the bearings, which was a big problem and they still have some problems installing the bearings.
So. If you order from Deng-fu and want a bb30 BB. Make sure that they fix this problem for your bike. Don't know how or if they will do it. But, now you know.

dogg
Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:37 am

by dogg

a tube spacer could probably remedy the issue

GONE4ARIDE
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri May 30, 2008 2:05 am

by GONE4ARIDE

For those of you with the new Hongfu FM069 road frame (or the FM066/66SL for that matter), what are you using for a chain keeper?

I recently built up one of my new FM069 frames, but due to the size of the seat tube and the cut-out design where the front derailleur braze-on is affixed to the frame, I am not able to mount a stock Sram chain keeper. The seat tube interferes with the keeper. Before getting the dremel tool out, or pursuing other modifications, I was wondering if any of you of have had success mounting other chain keepers without having to make any modifications?
Last edited by GONE4ARIDE on Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

siriz75
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:14 am

by siriz75

What are the main differences with the FM069 vs FM066s? Is the 69 an improvement or an all out new frame model? I currently have a dengfu '98 but was considering building up a super light frame....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

syncmaster
Posts: 106
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:56 pm

by syncmaster

Has anyone noticed Pedal Force's new QS4 frame? Love the matte finish. Internal routing is nice. Weight looks decent:
http://pedalforce.com/online/product_in ... s_id=23951

Image

User avatar
ms6073
Posts: 2409
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2004 8:24 pm
Location: Houston, Texas

by ms6073

I saw this frame today from Deng-fu.
Nice finish, but the bb30 box didn't have a "stopper" for the bearings, which was a big problem and they still have some problems installing the bearings
Look close at the imave and you will see tbe groove for tbe BB30 circlip. I raced on the FM059 when it was first introduced and had no issues with the BB30 bottom bracket.
Michael - The Anaerobic Threshold is neither...

Posix1b
Posts: 40
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:16 pm

by Posix1b

How is the fork clearance on this frame? Can I fit a 23mm tire on a Pacenti sl23 or Archetype rim with no issue?

glepore
Posts: 1103
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:42 pm
Location: Pa USA

by glepore

Posix1b wrote:How is the fork clearance on this frame? Can I fit a 23mm tire on a Pacenti sl23 or Archetype rim with no issue?


If you're talking about the 066, no problem. I run 28 mm Parigi Roubaix or 25 mm Vitorria Open Cx's on a 25 mm carbon rim without any fork or frame clearance issues.
Cysco Ti custom Campy SR mechanical (6.9);Cannondale SS Evo Di2 7970 (5.79); Willier Cento Uno Air Di2 9070 (7.0); C40 Mk2 DA 7800 ; Anvil Custom steel Etap;1996 Colnago Technos Record

Posix1b
Posts: 40
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:16 pm

by Posix1b

@glepore yes 066, thank you!

dogg
Posts: 291
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:37 am

by dogg

yeah you'll be fine, i run 28mm resist nomads (which come in at 29.5mm or so) and I've still got room. i reckon you could get a true 32mm tire in these frames

FlemishCompact
Posts: 63
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:56 pm

by FlemishCompact

I had no idea that the 066's had that much clearance! I could definitely picture myself building up one for off duty gravel grinding

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post