Hello Cannondale 2012 CAAD10, Farewell smooth welds?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
buikpijn
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:45 pm

by buikpijn

Just picked up my wifes new caad10 shimano 5700 105. (too bad they don't sell it with a force group here in Europe IMO)

Overall, I'm pleasantly surprised by the graphics on this bike. they look sweet in person. While cannondale never had a 'graphical touch' like Trek (mind you, this is my own opinion) they did a great job on this one. Besides the welds, the accents and details are very nice IMO. Saddle, wheels, etc. perfectly balanced. (again, my own opinion)

Since i've searched high and low for pics of this bike without any form of success, I thought I might do some of you a favor by posting them.

Anyway, here they are;

For full resolution click here

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Last edited by buikpijn on Sat Sep 17, 2011 2:35 pm, edited 7 times in total.

record
Posts: 944
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:02 pm
Location: EU

by record

Wow, liquigas color looks sweet.

i'm thinking of getting one of these myself. What's the retail price for it in Europe?
A light bike does replace good fitness.

buikpijn
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:45 pm

by buikpijn

the 2012 model 105 was initially released for 1449

One big let-down on the frame though; the welds aren't grinded/smoothed.. and this is typical for all previous aluminum cannondale models. untill now, i've never seen a cannondale frame with untreaded welds.
very, very disappointing to see a premium brand aluminum frame degrade to a glimpsy 'made in china' frame look..

I'll have to contact the bikeshop to see if this is normal.

BackRoadsBiker
Posts: 137
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:24 pm

by BackRoadsBiker

Good-looking bike!

The look of those welds is common of pretty much every other bike in that price range. The reason Cannondale AL frames of old had smooth looking welds was because they would do one welding pass for strength, then another over top of it for aesthetics. Under most other circumstances (not just in the bicycle industry), this final pass didn't really do much in terms of increasing strength. Stands to reason that in an effort to keep costs down, they did away with it altogether.
This board and the world in general would be a much nicer place if everyone could just take themselves a little less seriously.

buikpijn
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:45 pm

by buikpijn

the 2011 caad10 had smooth welds (as well as the cheaper caad8, if memory serves right)

5 8 5
Posts: 1353
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:36 am
Location: UK

by 5 8 5

Years ago Terry Dolan (UK framebuilder), when he was building me an aluminium frame, said that he didn't recommend smooth welds as he reckoned it weakened the join. BTW the frame is 10 yrs old and still going strong.

buikpijn
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:45 pm

by buikpijn

it takes preparation, a weld that is going to be machined takes more work to weld to begin with; The weld is made thicker so it leaves room for grinding. point is, cannondale has used this technique for ages, so i'd say they mastered the process enough to back it up with their lifetime warrantee. A normal weld isn't per se stronger than a nicely finished one. In these stress-areas, a round curve is stronger than a sharp edge (welds itself can have tiny relative sharp edges), it also releases the weld from stress.

it's simple cheaper to make a frame with rough welds. This is the wrong 'cost down' method for a company like cannondale, in my opinion. It's not that they lowered the price, in fact it's raised. After-all, it's a relative high price for an aluminum frame, and you take things in consideration why to opt for an aluminum cannondale over a carbon from another brand, in about the same price-range.

I won't jump to any conclusions yet as i would like to hear what the bikeshop has to say about this. Perhaps (and i hope) this frame is simple an isolated case of failed quality control.

This is more like it. Smoothed welds.
http://ysroad-shinjuku-beginnerkan.com/ ... 281%29.JPG

mclaren
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:02 pm

by mclaren

Cannondale dealers use the smooth welds as a selling feature. It makes the bike looks aesthetically pleasing and has little to no structural relevance. It was an attention to detail feature that supported the claim, and reality, of a quality product.

The question now is, has the quality of the product declined as a result of this detail?

Only the buyer can answer this question. Personally, smooth welds were something I liked. But if Cannondale has decided to no longer add this product feature and I am now paying more for the same product then the value equation and quality perception have decreased. Something Cannondale promised they would not do since outsourcing production overseas.

justkeepedaling
Posts: 1340
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:14 am
Location: by Crystal Springs (Sawyer Creek Trail)

by justkeepedaling

Smooth welds are only aesthetic, some would say unsmoothed has stronger welds

nitropowered
Posts: 1146
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2009 4:10 am

by nitropowered

If you want "smooth welds" just spend the extra $200 to get the SuperSix.

The cost of carbon has come down so much, its getting to the point where you would have to be stupid to want an aluminum bike, except for maybe a rain or crit bike

buikpijn
Posts: 82
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:45 pm

by buikpijn

@nitropowered; I guess you really have got no clue on what the (ride) quality of a good aluminum frame is. And that fictional 200usd number makes your statement even worse. Fyi, 105 caad10 and supersix 105 has a 650euro pricedifference here, which is roughly 900 usd.


@mclaren; exactly my point.

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jmilliron
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:03 pm
Location: San Francisco Peninsula

by jmilliron

My 2011 CAAD doesn't have totally filed down welds. And personally, don't care either way.
2013 Wilier Cento1 SR || 2009 Ridley Crossbow || 2011 Yeti AS-R 5 Carbon

GT56
Posts: 571
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:40 am
Location: Switzerland

by GT56

buikpijn wrote:it takes preparation, a weld that is going to be machined takes more work to weld to begin with; The weld is made thicker so it leaves room for grinding. point is, cannondale has used this technique for ages, so i'd say they mastered the process enough to back it up with their lifetime warrantee. A normal weld isn't per se stronger than a nicely finished one. In these stress-areas, a round curve is stronger than a sharp edge (welds itself can have tiny relative sharp edges), it also releases the weld from stress.

it's simple cheaper to make a frame with rough welds. This is the wrong 'cost down' method for a company like cannondale, in my opinion. It's not that they lowered the price, in fact it's raised. After-all, it's a relative high price for an aluminum frame, and you take things in consideration why to opt for an aluminum cannondale over a carbon from another brand, in about the same price-range.

I won't jump to any conclusions yet as i would like to hear what the bikeshop has to say about this. Perhaps (and i hope) this frame is simple an isolated case of failed quality control.

This is more like it. Smoothed welds.
http://ysroad-shinjuku-beginnerkan.com/ ... 281%29.JPG


your bikeshop will just show you more caad10's with exactly the same welds

lovenpeace
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:56 am

by lovenpeace

buikpijn wrote:it takes preparation, a weld that is going to be machined takes more work to weld to begin with; The weld is made thicker so it leaves room for grinding. point is, cannondale has used this technique for ages, so i'd say they mastered the process enough to back it up with their lifetime warrantee. A normal weld isn't per se stronger than a nicely finished one. In these stress-areas, a round curve is stronger than a sharp edge (welds itself can have tiny relative sharp edges), it also releases the weld from stress.

it's simple cheaper to make a frame with rough welds. This is the wrong 'cost down' method for a company like cannondale, in my opinion. It's not that they lowered the price, in fact it's raised. After-all, it's a relative high price for an aluminum frame, and you take things in consideration why to opt for an aluminum cannondale over a carbon from another brand, in about the same price-range.

I won't jump to any conclusions yet as i would like to hear what the bikeshop has to say about this. Perhaps (and i hope) this frame is simple an isolated case of failed quality control.

This is more like it. Smoothed welds.
http://ysroad-shinjuku-beginnerkan.com/ ... 281%29.JPG


If you look at the seattube-chainstay-toptube joint, you'll see it isn't very smooth. Same with the head-tube-downtube joint. Sad to say, but I hope this trend doesn't continue

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JesseD
Posts: 343
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:20 am

by JesseD

Personally I dont really care about the welds, as long as the bike performs as well as previous models.

Oh and I like the colour scheme on this one, looks pretty cool.

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