Cannondale SuperSix Evo4

[Spinnekop]

Yikes I'm aggravated about how high the stack is.

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

[TobinHatesYou]

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

Modern race bike fits have changed significantly in the past 5 years or so. Zero setback is in, slammed forward saddles and slightly raised saddles are in. Longer stems, narrower bars, flatter backs and the quest for lower CdA is in. Most race bikes are around 545mm for a 54cm and 565mm for a 56cm already...the SSE3 and SSE4 are basically Trek H2 fit.

IMO new releases should go lower like the Domane RSL which has a 527mm stack for the 54cm or the Lapierre Xelius SL with its 538mm stack / 393mm reach for a "55cm" equivalent. Argon 18 is another brand that gets it.

[wickedstealthy]

This is a taken3982A675-7480-4CD7-9D73-9587E9FCA62C.jpeg from a dealership brochure.
Think geo is the same

That's the Old Evo3 Geo

Yes and it's was taken from the brochure I have with the line up for 2023. Also with all the different t colourschemes

[Dan Gerous]

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

Modern race bike fits have changed significantly in the past 5 years or so. Zero setback is in, slammed forward saddles and slightly raised saddles are in. Longer stems, narrower bars, flatter backs and the quest for lower CdA is in. Most race bikes are around 545mm for a 54cm and 565mm for a 56cm already...the SSE3 and SSE4 are basically Trek H2 fit.

IMO new releases should go lower like the Domane RSL which has a 527mm stack for the 54cm or the Lapierre Xelius SL with its 538mm stack / 393mm reach for a "55cm" equivalent. Argon 18 is another brand that gets it.

True in the pro fields, but the big majority of people buying those bikes, even those wo race, still have and need a bunch of spacers under their stems... even FDJ's GC man David Gaudu needs a tower of spacers on his Xelius SL!

[dudemanppl]

Yikes I'm aggravated about how high the stack is.

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

Yes, and the fact that you can't turn or you'll break the frame. The new one fixes the second part of that, but it's still uselessly high and amazingly overpriced.

[wickedstealthy]

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

Modern race bike fits have changed significantly in the past 5 years or so. Zero setback is in, slammed forward saddles and slightly raised saddles are in. Longer stems, narrower bars, flatter backs and the quest for lower CdA is in. Most race bikes are around 545mm for a 54cm and 565mm for a 56cm already...the SSE3 and SSE4 are basically Trek H2 fit.

IMO new releases should go lower like the Domane RSL which has a 527mm stack for the 54cm or the Lapierre Xelius SL with its 538mm stack / 393mm reach for a "55cm" equivalent. Argon 18 is another brand that gets it.

True in the pro fields, but the big majority of people buying those bikes, even those wo race, still have and need a bunch of spacers under their stems... even FDJ's GC man David Gaudu needs a tower of spacers on his Xelius SL!

Idd. Most cant handle drops above 10cm. So you see stupid setup on the popular SL7 overhere with spacertowers of 4-5cm. Many ride with spacers stacks above 3cm. So basicallu they need another bike plain and simple. Im 177 and can handle a drop of around 11cm at age 50. I ride a lot and this bike means I dont have to revert to spacers to have a proper setup

[wheelsONfire]

The stats given above is that of the Evo3. So you were aggravated by the old Evo3?

The new bike's Stack differs with 1mm.

Modern race bike fits have changed significantly in the past 5 years or so. Zero setback is in, slammed forward saddles and slightly raised saddles are in. Longer stems, narrower bars, flatter backs and the quest for lower CdA is in. Most race bikes are around 545mm for a 54cm and 565mm for a 56cm already...the SSE3 and SSE4 are basically Trek H2 fit.

IMO new releases should go lower like the Domane RSL which has a 527mm stack for the 54cm or the Lapierre Xelius SL with its 538mm stack / 393mm reach for a "55cm" equivalent. Argon 18 is another brand that gets it.

True in the pro fields, but the big majority of people buying those bikes, even those wo race, still have and need a bunch of spacers under their stems... even FDJ's GC man David Gaudu needs a tower of spacers on his Xelius SL!

Idd. Most cant handle drops above 10cm. So you see stupid setup on the popular SL7 overhere with spacertowers of 4-5cm. Many ride with spacers stacks above 3cm. So basicallu they need another bike plain and simple. Im 177 and can handle a drop of around 11cm at age 50. I ride a lot and this bike means I dont have to revert to spacers to have a proper setup

I think you are right on. Cervelos old fit and Ax Lightness geometry is totally made after stats from thousands of bike fits.
Sadly most people who doesn't fit on bikes like Specialized buy them anyway. But it's their problems...

[TobinHatesYou]

True in the pro fields, but the big majority of people buying those bikes, even those wo race, still have and need a bunch of spacers under their stems... even FDJ's GC man David Gaudu needs a tower of spacers on his Xelius SL!

These are race bikes meant for those elite fields and should be designed that way. Endurance geometry is over here —>

[Singular]

Wait, I'm just getting my soapbax and my hobby-horse circle argument of people having too low bars - bikes having shorter head tubes than what's suitable - too much time being spent on the hoods.

Now, as I said....!

[tarmackev]

Thankfuly stems come in different angles and you can move them.

[TobinHatesYou]

Wait, I'm just getting my soapbax and my hobby-horse circle argument of people having too low bars - bikes having shorter head tubes than what's suitable - too much time being spent on the hoods.

Now, as I said....!

Endurance geometry race bikes exist and are plentiful. Just look at the geometry of a Time AdH or a Seka Exceed or an Open Min.D or…

There's also the fact that effective stack heights are increasing with integrated cable routing because the upper bearing covers are getting taller.

[C36]

We always have the same problem, too many people choose their frame first (I love xxx model) and only then adapt to the geometry. There are frames that should not be for you cause the geometry doesn't fit, plain and simple.
Btw that's one of the reason why we see pro with too long stems: to accomodate the masses of amateur riders, the frames are not low and long enough and pro's have to compromise when 10 years ago they could have custom frames.

[wickedstealthy]

True in the pro fields, but the big majority of people buying those bikes, even those wo race, still have and need a bunch of spacers under their stems... even FDJ's GC man David Gaudu needs a tower of spacers on his Xelius SL!

These are race bikes meant for those elite fields and should be designed that way. Endurance geometry is over here —>

Good argument but then I would suggest that they pay those bikes themselves instead of the general public. My problem with endurance geometry is that they in a lot of cases are again the other extreme. Specialised is famous for that. Their Endurace stuff mostly is with stacks that are way too high and their race bikes are low. Next my biggest issue is that the endurance category is treated as second or third line when it comes to weight, components and aesthetics. I don't want an ugly duck like a Roubaix I want to pay max 1000 euro for such a bike nothing more. My personal opinion but it is just so ugly.

I have a Canyon Endurace rim and now a v3rs. Ok it's on the relax side but about 10cm of drop. More then my Canyon anyway. However, the stupid Colnago feels 10x better in compliance then that Endurace. Never felt as now how uncomfortable the Canyon was. Heavier, slower, less aggressive but hard in the wrong ways.

The best option would be that they introduce something like what Parlee did where you can choose within each size 3 different versions. Yes it's expensive but for the price they are charging on top frames that is almost custom territory ...


I just want a nice looking bike fully integrated with top components etc something I appreciate and want to ride 15k a year. Price is less of an issue as I keep my bikes not with the intention of selling them 2y later

[wickedstealthy]

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[Hexsense]

My "correct" frame size would be size 50-52.
[ When I used SuperSix, I had to use size 48 with 120mm stem because size 51 was too tall at the head tube, even with 17 degree stem.
Going to SystemSix was a good change. I can use SystemSix size 51 with 110mm stem because it has about the same stack as SuperSix size 48. ]
Or so I originally thought. In reality, I could totally use SuperSix size 51 with -25 degree stem, or something like Syntace Flatforce or FSA-SLK drop stem to bring the handlebar below head tube level. So, headtube isn't really too tall since there is technically a way to make it fit.

FSA SL-K drop stem. Not my picture.

In the past, headtube are sized toward the short side with the idea that you can raise it up with spacers but you can't make it shorter. That ends up leaving most users with some spacers. And for some, it'd be especially tall.
An alternate idea would be to gear it toward the median. Then anyone need bar lower than average can use drop stem to achieve their preferred bar height.

So, Cannondale. Bring on even taller head tube and release -25 degree stem with 15mm downward offset stem for me!
Most average rider will be happier with taller head tube. And serious racers won't mind having aggressive looking stem.