Hit by a car yesterday, is my frame OK?

[Mr. Boots]

So, I got hit by a car yesterday here in Colorado... I'm ok but my bike is a little worse for wear: the fork and front wheel are definitely trashed:


I haven't taken the tape off the handlebars to check for damage there (Easton EC90SLX), but those could possibly be cracked as well. I also haven't taken the fork out to inspect the head tube, but I am wondering, how do you know for sure if there is damage or not? If there is a visible crack, then obviously that is not good, but what if there isn't a visible crack, are you definitely good to go? It's an 08 Ridley Excalibur, FWIW...

Anybody have experince with this?

[CharlesM]

Have the shop inspect and OK it.

Appologies, but Nobody hear can give you a crash damage assesment.

[Danton]

Exactly Pez. Even then a shop is likely to say "if you're not sure, replace it".

[breakjnky]

I have a two part answer for you.....

First, I would have your bike checked. Most bike shops that are legit will check it for you for free because they know the stress of getting hit. After I got hit once, I was fine, and my bike appeared to be fine. After riding a few hundred miles more, my bontrager race x lite carbon bars failed at the clamp. They were never over tightened, but I think the stress of crashing maybe broke some fibers, and more and more stress eventually lead to a big crack in them. Most importantly, I would check all the welds, parts, even scuffs on your saddle.

That being said, if anything is wrong....make the driver pay for it! Assuming you are not obviously liable for the accident (even if you are you can get away with this) they should being paying out of pocket, or their insurance should for anything that is broken. If you have a friend who is a lawyer and won't charge you to make a few 5 minute phone calls.....it will cost them more to hire an attorney than to pay for your damages. It happened to me, and the guy wanted to avoid it so much, he just sent me cash for my bike, even though the accident was "technically" my fault, even though it was really his. A $5,000 legal bill is a lot more expensive than a few hundred in bike parts.

[Mr. Boots]

Have the shop inspect and OK it.

Appologies, but Nobody hear can give you a crash damage assesment.

hmm... well, what are they going to look for? Mechanics are not magicians. I was trained as a mechanic and worked as one for three years. The first company I worked for had a good training program which used the best-respected name in the business for their training materials; we never covered damaged carbon. I don't think mechanics really get trained on this, they just "look" at it and call it dead if it's been crashed. I know how to use a frame alignment guide and look for obvious cracks, but other than that what do you look for? It seems like if you take a crashed frame into a shop they are almost always going to tell you to replace, due to liability.

[rustychain]

I have a two part answer for you.....

First, I would have your bike checked. Most bike shops that are legit will check it for you for free because they know the stress of getting hit. After I got hit once, I was fine, and my bike appeared to be fine. After riding a few hundred miles more, my bontrager race x lite carbon bars failed at the clamp. They were never over tightened, but I think the stress of crashing maybe broke some fibers, and more and more stress eventually lead to a big crack in them. Most importantly, I would check all the welds, parts, even scuffs on your saddle.

That being said, if anything is wrong....make the driver pay for it! Assuming you are not obviously liable for the accident (even if you are you can get away with this) they should being paying out of pocket, or their insurance should for anything that is broken. If you have a friend who is a lawyer and won't charge you to make a few 5 minute phone calls.....it will cost them more to hire an attorney than to pay for your damages. It happened to me, and the guy wanted to avoid it so much, he just sent me cash for my bike, even though the accident was "technically" my fault, even though it was really his. A $5,000 legal bill is a lot more expensive than a few hundred in bike parts.

Do you sleep well at night?

[Geoff]

Agreed. If a mechanic gave an 'OK' for a crashed component which later failed causing injury... well, you get the picture. If it is an insurable loss, it would be safer to replace the frame and fork (any structural carbon, for that matter).

[icculus]

hmm... well, what are they going to look for? Mechanics are not magicians. I was trained as a mechanic and worked as one for three years. The first company I worked for had a good training program which used the best-respected name in the business for their training materials; we never covered damaged carbon. I don't think mechanics really get trained on this, they just "look" at it and call it dead if it's been crashed. I know how to use a frame alignment guide and look for obvious cracks, but other than that what do you look for? It seems like if you take a crashed frame into a shop they are almost always going to tell you to replace, due to liability.

One of the biggest things they can check is frame alignment if they have the correct tools. This is more of a problem for Steel or Aluminum frames but Carbon frames can be affected as well. A frame can look perfectly fine but it is going to ride like shit, not be able to handle well, and cause all kinds of shifting problems if the rear triangle is out of line with the front wheel.

Anyways, it sounds like you are qualified enough to look at your bike and determine if you think it is alright to ride. You could ask any expert that you want if your frame is alright but that guarantee is only as good as your trust in them. There is no "magic" test that will %100 percent guarantee that your bike is perfect. Look at it..... check stress points..... check the bars and fork...... if everything looks good take it easy for a few days and try to avoid 80km/hr descents. Good luck and hope you are alright.

[obra3]

So, I got hit by a car yesterday here in Colorado... I'm ok but my bike is a little worse for wear: the fork and front wheel are definitely trashed:


I haven't taken the tape off the handlebars to check for damage there (Easton EC90SLX), but those could possibly be cracked as well. I also haven't taken the fork out to inspect the head tube, but I am wondering, how do you know for sure if there is damage or not? If there is a visible crack, then obviously that is not good, but what if there isn't a visible crack, are you definitely good to go? It's an 08 Ridley Excalibur, FWIW...

Anybody have experince with this?

I'd get a new bike. If there was enough force to destroy a fork and a wheel, there's a possibility there's more damage. Dark areas are a telltale sign of compromised CF. (But since the bike is painted- it's next to impossible to tell) If I were in yours shoes, I would not ride it again. The question would be- would you put someone you love on that bike. My answer would invariably be no after a significant crash especially if it involves a car.

Mr. Boots- that looks like a Hagens Berman color scheme... is it???

[boots2000]

Biggest question is- was it the drivers fault and is his/her insurance paying?
I got car doored several years ago (drivers fault)- I demanded that his insurance pay for everything- ended up being a new bike. Carbon can be damaged in an impact like that- do you really want to be doing Mtn. descents on a bike that has had that sort of impact to it? Pretty much all carbon parts are out of warranty after a crash like that (all manuals for bars, etc. say "replace after a crash").

[lancejohnson]

The problem with assessing carbon damage is that you could have a crack that will compromise the frame in the lower layers of the laminate, but the force did not crack the surface layers. With a visual inspection you would assume that it is safe to ride. If you fixture the frame to an alignment table you may notice extra flex in the frame that is a sign of something wrong, but you may not. The only foolproof way to assess whether your frame is toast is to get an MRI - at least as far as I know. In lieu of that, I'd replace it if a fork, front wheel and possibly bar were destroyed. That much force would most likely compromise the frame as well.

Ridley may have a decent crash replacement program and make it possible for you to come out ahead on the deal even.

[obra3]

Biggest question is- was it the drivers fault and is his/her insurance paying?
I got car doored several years ago (drivers fault)- I demanded that his insurance pay for everything- ended up being a new bike. Carbon can be damaged in an impact like that- do you really want to be doing Mtn. descents on a bike that has had that sort of impact to it? Pretty much all carbon parts are out of warranty after a crash like that (all manuals for bars, etc. say "replace after a crash").

I wouldn't consider fault in this. The primary concern should be of safety- and risk.

Yeah- shoot Lance/Sinclair an e-mail about it- like soon. LD is a really stand up guy.

[Birillo]

I would turn the question around. It is for the driver to prove that the frame is safe. You have sufficient evidence to claim that it is unsafe.

[boots2000]

That is not what I meant. What I meant was if the replacement is coming from the drivers insurance- replace everything- visually damaged or not. Coming from your pocket- replace everything damaged, especially frame, fork, bars, front wheel.

Biggest question is- was it the drivers fault and is his/her insurance paying?
I got car doored several years ago (drivers fault)- I demanded that his insurance pay for everything- ended up being a new bike. Carbon can be damaged in an impact like that- do you really want to be doing Mtn. descents on a bike that has had that sort of impact to it? Pretty much all carbon parts are out of warranty after a crash like that (all manuals for bars, etc. say "replace after a crash").

I wouldn't consider fault in this. The primary concern should be of safety- and risk.

Yeah- shoot Lance/Sinclair an e-mail about it- like soon. LD is a really stand up guy.

[Ypsylon]

the accident was "technically" my fault, even though it was really his.

I know this doesn't help the OP at all and is OT, but how in the world can that be?