New bike purchase - spend money on high-level bike or another China frame?

[Matt28NJ]

I just turned 41. I ride every day, but I stopped racing years ago due to kids and career demands on my time. I've owned some decent bikes - Felt AR1, Cervelo S2, etc.

I'm also 41, ride just about every day, and have slowed down my racing due to kids and career demands on my time. I've also owned some elite bikes, and currently my race bike is a Venge, and I commute to work occasionally on my beater, my former race bike, a Tarmac Pro.

I've scratched my itch over the last few years simply by buying used framesets from fellow racers who change bikes like they change chamois cream. The market is bonkers now in terms of price and scarcity for many items, but it won't be this way forever. I'd personally look for quality used frames if you can be patient.

I don't know how many kids you have, but we're committed to paying for 3 college educations for ours, so $10k+ bikes are out of the question for me so buying used framesets is the way to go for me.

[Miller]

I'm another who thinks brand-name frames are horribly over-priced. Anything with a weighty name costs GBP/EUR/USD 3k and up. Do they have a technical advantage over a Chinese open-mould frame? Possibly. Could Pog win the Tour on a Chinese frame? Of course. Does a brand-name frame survive a stack better than a Chinese frame? Of course not.

If you drop a modest amount on a Chinese frame then you can afford to take a risk on a geo or style you might have not have done if faced with a bigger outlay, you can cheerfully ride the crap out of it, and you don't need to feel guilty about spending your childrens' inheritance. Plus you'll end up with something no-one else you know has because they're all riding identikit spesh/bianchi/treks.

[spud]

My experience - brand name expensive frames have better fit and finish than the chinese generics. So the axles fit better, the hangers are higher quality/more rigid, the cable ports are nicer etc etc. They build up easier, are easier to take wheels in and out of, and are nicer to look at generally. Will they make you faster? Absolutely not. Haven't crashed any road bikes in a while so not in a position to differentiate toughness.

[liam7020]

I've had my fair share of high end marques aa well as also open mold frames and I have to say I can no longer justify the price of the big brand items. To the OP - how about you buy an open mold frame from one of the most reputable vendors and then have it customed sprayed by somebody like ETOE, Ooey Custom, Kustomflow or whoever there is in your neck of the woods. You've have a unique frame and still a fraction of the cost of Colnago etc.

[liam7020]

I've had my fair share of high end marques as well as also open mold frames and I have to say I can no longer justify the price of the big brand items. To the OP - how about you buy an open mold frame from one of the most reputable vendors and then have it customed sprayed by somebody like ETOE, Ooey Custom, Kustomflow or whoever there is in your neck of the woods. You've have a unique frame and still a fraction of the cost of Colnago etc.

[Miller]

The Chinese suppliers will do any colour under the sun for a modest price.

[inertianinja]

When you're racing, the (real or imagined) risk of an open mold dud eventually taking you down shrinks to insignificance compared to the general risk of race madness taking you down.

Wheras when you've aged out of racing you're only left with the general dangers of regular road usage and suddenly frame reliability creeps into view. Your bones are more brittle now, reactions slower and muscles weaker (those used you protect from injury in a crash far more so than those kept in shape by pushing pedals)

I'd say it's perfectly logical to leave the open mold value to young racers and the pro cosplay irrationality to an older audience. If you want to tone down the irrationality a little there's always the "Ultegra class" from the same brands (often even the same frames).

Oddly enough, Reliability is really a not factor in this decision for me - I don't doubt the reliability of a good open mold frame. There's a whole long thread about open mold frames - if reliability was really bad, you'd hear about it in there for sure.

Personally I've been riding this frame on NYC streets for 3 years, potholes and all - far more stress than it would see in a race - with no issues.

To the contrary, it was Factor who had a significant reliability issue if I recall

[inertianinja]

I just turned 41. I ride every day, but I stopped racing years ago due to kids and career demands on my time. I've owned some decent bikes - Felt AR1, Cervelo S2, etc.

I'm also 41, ride just about every day, and have slowed down my racing due to kids and career demands on my time. I've also owned some elite bikes, and currently my race bike is a Venge, and I commute to work occasionally on my beater, my former race bike, a Tarmac Pro.

I've scratched my itch over the last few years simply by buying used framesets from fellow racers who change bikes like they change chamois cream. The market is bonkers now in terms of price and scarcity for many items, but it won't be this way forever. I'd personally look for quality used frames if you can be patient.

I don't know how many kids you have, but we're committed to paying for 3 college educations for ours, so $10k+ bikes are out of the question for me so buying used framesets is the way to go for me.

I hear you. We just had our second last month, so the end of fun spending is nigh

I too have mostly done used bikes in the past. I had a lot of fun putting modern groups on older bikes. Then the open mold experiment worked out. But now im thinking - maybe last chance for a truly selfish purchase?

[inertianinja]

.

[Matt28NJ]

But now im thinking - maybe last chance for a truly selfish purchase?

As I get older, I recognize there is precious little difference between most large brand's carbon race frames, regardless of what their marketing departments would like us to think.

These days, I just want a bike with a kick-ass paint job. Something that makes me look at it and want to go ride. That's my issue with the open mold frames, they usually have a crappy (or no) paintjob.

For me, a middle ground would be a custom painted open mold frame from a trusted source.

[inertianinja]

But now im thinking - maybe last chance for a truly selfish purchase?

As I get older, I recognize there is precious little difference between most large brand's carbon race frames, regardless of what their marketing departments would like us to think.

These days, I just want a bike with a kick-ass paint job. Something that makes me look at it and want to go ride. That's my issue with the open mold frames, they usually have a crappy (or no) paintjob.

For me, a middle ground would be a custom painted open mold frame from a trusted source.

That, plus for some reason most mainstream bikes (Trek, Canyon, etc) just don't excite me enough to justify like $8,000.

Custom painted open mold is on the table. I have actually already emailed Winspace about whether they'd do custom paint.

[AJS914]

I'm a little bit in the same postion but I'm shocked enough by the price of $6000 carbon frames that I'm just sitting on the sidelines until the rigth frame at the right price presents itself. I could afford it. I just have a hard time with a $6000 piece of plastic with a short warranty!

I'm also into the kick ass paint job. If money were no object, I'd get a Colnago C64 in the right art decor color scheme. I was kind of hoping a used, like-new, rim brake frame would show up for half price and then I'd just ride rim brakes for another bunch of years.

I've always like Time frames and I have my eye on a rim brake Alpe d'Huez. They can be found on super sale frequently.

I also wouldn't mind something more aero. That would probably mean disk brakes, 12 speed, new sets of wheels, and getting rid of all my used parts.

So, I just keep riding my C59 until I figure it out.

[AJS914]

Also, I was thinking that there is a middle ground between a $500 open mold frame and a top shelf $5000+ frame. I like the SL7 for an aeroish option. $5500 though for an S-Works frameset seems like way too much for a Tarmac. I think I'd be perfectly happy with the $3300 Specialized branded version or even the much cheaper SL6 with a top shelf groupset.

Winspace was previously mentioned. It seems like the "premium" Asian made frame is becoming a thing. There were a few topics on that Seka frameset. It also targets the premium Asian market.

The other way to go is direct to consumer like Canyon. Fezzari is also a Utah based direct to consumer bike company. A friend has one and loves it. When you compare the Fezzari Empire to the Tarmac, the value is astonishing.

[ms6073]

But now im thinking - maybe last chance for a truly selfish purchase?

As I get older, I recognize there is precious little difference between most large brand's carbon race frames, regardless of what their marketing departments would like us to think.

I was in that boat a couple years back when I was riding a 2016 Scott Solace disc road frame equipped with DA R9170. Some 40-years ago I got a Colnago through team sponsorship and despite riding some really good bikes since, in the back of my mind, I had always wanted another but as time passed, I could never quite convince myself there was actually enough of a difference to spend that kind of money. The wife and I have been riding gravel bikes built on open-mold carbon frames purchased from China nearly 3-years ago and they do an adequate job, but in 2020 I was trading emails with the wholesaler for the paint and graphics for an open mold endurance frameset when I decided it was time.

Despite the pandemic moving into high gear, having found an online store in Italy that would save $$$ over US sites, I ordered a Colnago C64 disc in September of 2020 . The frameset was delivered the first week of December and once I got it built, my elation on the first ride was comparible to that kid in the movie who got a Red Ryder BB gun for Christmas. Is the Colnago better than the open mold I was contemplating, who knows, and although I am now apprehensive that Colnago may soon introduce a successor to the C64 (C68 ), but until that time I will continue to enjoy every minue I spend on that bike.

[Usernamealex]

How about somewhere in the middle like a reliable, reasonably priced frame like a Giant TCR?

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