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Winter road shoes

Posted: Wed Jan 01, 2020 8:57 pm
by IvanZg
This November and December I did probably 2-3x more riding outside then on Zwift and enjoyed myself immensely regardless the temperatures and conditions outside. November was ok as temperatures were rather high for this time of year but December got a bit colder. At the moment I'm using Giro Sentrie Techlace with shoe covers and that setup works well for 2-3h rides while temperatures do not drop below 5 degC. Unfortunately this does not work for current conditions. I did few rides in last few days with temperatures being -5 degC and had huge issues with numb toes. My favorite loop includes lots of climbing and then one huge descent before arriving home. That takes around 20 minutes with high speed in the shade so with wind chill factor real temperature gets to around -15degC. After that I have 40 minutes of slower descending trough city traffic with almost no pedaling so my feet get additional cooling....
I thought getting some better overshoes was the solution. But after some googling and seeing that prices of overshoes can easily get to 100+ euros I thought getting pair of winter shoes was the better option.

I'd prefer something that accommodates look style cleats and it's not bulky as mountaineering boot. I narrowed my choice to:
Fizik Artica R5
Lake CX145
Northwave Extreme RR 3 GTX

Reviews say how all of them are okay in colder conditions but I have no clue what that means as there are no temperatures mentioned. So I'd like to know what are your experiences with using them in temperatures bellow freezing. I'm not concerned with waterproofness as weather here is mostly dry throughout winter.

Cheers

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:04 pm
by ultimobici
I've been using Shimano Goretex winter road & mountain boots for nigh on 10 years now. I have poor circulation in my feet and hands so gloves and shoes are particularly important to me. Temperatures rarely get below -10° so my feet are usually toasty. Couple of friends have Northwave GTX shoes that they speak well of.

That said, I wonder if you may be undermining yourself in winter by possibly using thicker socks with shoes that fit perfectly in summer. Many people make the mistake and end up cutting off circulation leading to numb or cold feet. My boots are a size up allowing for thick winter sock and a little air to keep my feet warm.


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Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:04 pm
by Weenie

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:33 am
by IrrelevantD
I have some older Northwave GTX Arctic that I use when it's down below 5°C and love them. I wear Giro In summer and bought the same size. The Northwaves are a little bigger (intentionally I think) so you can wear thicker socks and still have room to move your toes.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 8:16 am
by IvanZg
I do have enough space even with thicker socks so I do not believe cold is caused due to restricted blood flow.

@IrrelevantD
Did you ran those shoes with additional overshoes over them? I noticed that NW dial has a small lever on the side. Could putting additional overshoes over them accidently release the tension while riding?

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:06 pm
by gb123bike
I love my Lake MXZ-303's. They're OK for me with normal socks down to about -10C, and with wool socks down to -30C (though that's starting to push the limit). However, everybody has different physiology, blood flow, etc, so your results could be a lot different from mine. I have bigger issues with keeping my hands warm than with my feet.

They have recessed cleat areas and are quite walkable. They do have a boa style closure, which some people aren't taken with. I might've picked laces if I could, but so far the boas are working fine and are certainly faster to get the shoe on and off with. Also when I used to run lace shoes in the winter, the laces would sometimes freeze up with frozen slush and be hard to undo at the end of the ride.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:26 pm
by IrrelevantD
IvanZg wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 8:16 am
I do have enough space even with thicker socks so I do not believe cold is caused due to restricted blood flow.

@IrrelevantD
Did you ran those shoes with additional overshoes over them? I noticed that NW dial has a small lever on the side. Could putting additional overshoes over them accidently release the tension while riding?
I have the older style with laces and a flap over them. If the new ones are anything like the old ones, there is no need for overshoes with the Arctic unless you want additional waterproofing above the ankle cuff. I've been eyeing the newer ones with the Boa type dial, but haven't pulled the trigger on them yet.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 5:15 am
by bikeboy1tr
I have a pair of the Northwave Extreme XCM 2 GTX boots and was extremely disappointed with them compared to an older pair of the Northwave Arctics that I still wear. The Northwave Extreme XCM 2 GTX and the Northwave Extreme RR 3 GTX are essentially the same boot cept for the cleat mounts. I wear a bootie cover over mine and my feet are still cold 1-2 degrees above zero whereas I can wear a bootie cover over my old ones and I am good for -5 no problem.
I am a huge fan of Northwave and have many pairs of their shoes and just ordered a pair of the Northwave Himilayas for some serious cold weather riding but I will not likely be out in much cooler than -7.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 5:51 am
by IrrelevantD
So one thing to note... I think Northwave still has the Arctic versions in their lineup... GTX just means it has Goretex and a little extra room for thick socks. GTX Arctic has an additional layer of insulation and is rated for lower temps.

I'm going to assume that the current verison of what I have is going to be Flash Arctic GTX. The RR probably doesn't have that extra insulation.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:15 am
by IvanZg
This got a bit confusing now. It looks like Extreme RR 3 GTX are warmer then new version of Flash Arctic GTX as they are marked with 5 bars on their website when it comes to thermal insulation compared to 4 bars for Arctic GTX.
If I managed with summer shoes and not the best overshoes I believe any of this decision will be an improvement. I’ll put an order for fizik and NW rr3 today and see how they fit and feel in person.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:18 pm
by ryanw
I have the NW EXTREME XCM 2 GTX shoes / boots for my CX bike. They're ok, but I had to size up for thicker socks.

One word of warning, they have zero air / drains holes, so when water gets into the shoe (which it will), your feet will be sitting in water until you take the shoe off and empty it.

Mine are now in storage and I used S-Works 6 XC shoes with warm socks and shoe covers since they have the ability to drain.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 8:30 pm
by madik
I bought last season Sidi Zero Gore-Tex. I thought they would be perfect to everything between 0-10C and they definitely are not! 5-10C at best. Unfortunately they really didn't improve over summer shoes (Sidi Wire) plus neopren overshoes, thermal comfort is about the same which is quite a shame tbh. So they are good for maybe Italian winter at Sicily at best!
Have to bought new thin Northwave overshoes to be able to drive around zero degrees.
And what's even more disappointing is terrible watter resistance. They withstand some drops just fine, but anything more intensive turns into water inside. In one winter ride with a lot standing water my feets got very wet and had to shorten my ride.
Well only positive feuture is high breathability :) Stay away!

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:26 pm
by siim
gb123bike wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:06 pm
I love my Lake MXZ-303's. They're OK for me with normal socks down to about -10C, and with wool socks down to -30C (though that's starting to push the limit). However, everybody has different physiology, blood flow, etc, so your results could be a lot different from mine.
I can echo above having used same Lakes now for few rides. Not yet in freezing conditions but at 0-5c they have kept my feet toasty warm even with regular summer socks. In some strange way I'm even looking forward for some colder days now :)
But these shoes sure are bulky - I tried also MX145 but these were too narrow for my feet and would probably not been good for rides below 0 c.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:58 pm
by ghostinthemachine
I use the GTX versions of the northwave both on and off road (the old ones with laces and velcro flaps) i've found that a pair of thermal socks paired with something like woolie boolies or sealskins (depending on exactly how cold/wet everything is) will let me ride for up to a couple of hours at -15 degC. Have the beginnings off cold toes by the end of it, nothing unpleasant, just a warning!

With just thermal socks paired with normal cycling socks, and a 4 hour ride at 0-3 degC, including a few wades through puddles too deep/muddy/root filled to ride, and finishing off with 10 km into a block headwind at 25~30kph. If anything, it was a bit too hot.
ryanw wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:18 pm
One word of warning, they have zero air / drains holes, so when water gets into the shoe (which it will), your feet will be sitting in water until you take the shoe off and empty it.
Drain holes will let cold air in. Either use proper mudguards and stop most of the water getting in in the first place, or wear sealskins, then the water usually gets in slowly enough that you can warm it up. If it's too cold for that, their generally isn't any water, just ice.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:58 pm
by jfranci3
I didn't have good luck with the Northwave GTX shoes. My sweat would wet them out in about 2 hours and they didn't have enough volume. They've only got one adjustment, so I couldn't get them comfortable. I tried the Fizik Artica, but these were too heavy duty for my needs and I say a lot of them had the outter shell / zipper issues on ebay/gear trade/amazon warehouse .

I'm back to wearing thin socks in normal shoes and sealskinz waterproof outter socks for insulation. I might pick up some Mavic Crossmax CM or Lake CX145-x if I find a deal.

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:58 pm
by Weenie

Re: Winter road shoes

Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:28 pm
by velomane
Numerous references in this thread about how perspiration leads to cold feet. I agree. I surmised years ago that if my feet are getting cold because of the sweat, then reduce the sweat. I rub my feet with antiperspirant before heading out on days where the temperature is at or below the freezing point. My conclusion, though anecdotal, is that my feet are warmer as a result. Anyone else try this?