Did today’s Tour Stage just prove that disc brakes on road bikes are a manufactured marketing sham?

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Jugi
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by Jugi

Keep a 6mm allen key in a jersey pocket, it's something in the range of 8-12 revolutions both ways. Yes, quite slow.

Wheel change speed - sorted. Axle standards - seem to be sorted at 12mm for both axles. But how does neutral support shim their brake discs in a way they won't rub the pads on anyone's bike? Inside a team it should be doable as frames, hubs and brakes can be basicly same for all riders. It is quite a lot different for the whole peloton.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

I don’t think racers in the pro Peloton are going to start carrying tools in their jersey pockets, particularly something like a 6mm Allen key. That’s not something I’d want anywhere close to my spine when going down in a crash.
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LeDuke
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by LeDuke

Calnago wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:04 pm
I don’t think racers in the pro Peloton are going to start carrying tools in their jersey pockets, particularly something like a 6mm Allen key. That’s not something I’d want anywhere close to my spine when going down in a crash.
Gee, if only there was a solution to this non-problem that allowed people to change their wheels without a tool.

http://www.wheelbuilder.com/dt-swiss-rw ... kewer.html

Priit
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by Priit

bencolem wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:40 am
Biggest climbs = biggest descents = most braking required.

And no disc brakes in sight today.

Did today’s Tour Stage just prove that disc brakes on road bikes are a manufactured marketing sham?

Rim brakes make for lighter (and more aero as confirmed by Argon 18 recently) bikes (which are therefore faster, more responsive and more enjoyable) and clearly offer sufficient braking power.

Manufacturer’s put disc brakes on the aero bikes for the flat stages... where braking requirements aren’t as intense.

Still, cracking stage.
Sure, disc brakes on road RACING bikes are utterly stupid idea.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Or better yet, just flip a lever and the wheel drops out. Like magic. And goes back in just as easy. If only...
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themidge
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by themidge

Wait, through axles don't have a lever? Do you always need an allen key to undo them?
Anyway, QRs will always be faster in as skilled an experienced hands as can do a 15 second (or whatever it is) TA change.

Thanos
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by Thanos

themidge wrote:Wait, through axles don't have a lever? Do you always need an allen key to undo them?
Anyway, QRs will always be faster in as skilled an experienced hands as can do a 15 second (or whatever it is) TA change.
Can't tell if being sarcastic?

My TA's on my gravel bike are both QR, i.e. with a lever, no allan key needed.

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Thanos
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by Thanos

themidge wrote:Not being sarcastic, I thought they all had levers on them.. :noidea:
My wife's don't, they are a right pain in the arse!

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bilwit
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by bilwit

themidge wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:48 pm
Not being sarcastic, I thought they all had levers on them.. :noidea:
some do some don't
Jugi wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:45 pm
Axle standards - seem to be sorted at 12mm for both axles. But how does neutral support shim their brake discs in a way they won't rub the pads on anyone's bike? Inside a team it should be doable as frames, hubs and brakes can be basicly same for all riders. It is quite a lot different for the whole peloton.
I wonder if they take out and reuse the same axle from the wheel they're replacing if they take a wheel from neutral service.. the neutral service axle could be "the same standard" but completely different thread pitch which won't be able to screw in :lol:

NickJHP
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by NickJHP

I reckon the biggest advantages of discs are:

1. Short of trashing a rim with a crash or big pothole hit, your rims won't need periodic replacing. Rim brake rims last me about two to three years before needing replacing. A couple of times over the years I have left replacement too late and had the rim sidewall thin to the point where it disintegrated. Swapping out worn pads/rotors is considerably easier than replacing rims.

2. Easy swap of wheel sizes. On my Open Upper I run 700c rims with 30mm tyres for on road use and 650b with 48mm tyres for gravel and mixed on/off road. Can't do that sort of swap with rim brakes.

Nick

mattr
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by mattr

bilwit wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:57 pm
I wonder if they take out and reuse the same axle from the wheel they're replacing if they take a wheel from neutral service..
the axle tends to be part of the frame. The wheel just has a hole and shoulders on the end of the hub to meet whatever spec is needed. Think there are three 142x12 axle standards, but only one hub standard.

Jugi
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by Jugi

themidge wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:42 pm
Wait, through axles don't have a lever?
The application discussed was something that can be screwed in and out with a 6mm allen key - either with your standard L shaped key, a proprietary detachable handle or an electric tool a team mechanic would have at hand.

Thru axles with fixed levers are not disappearing from the face of earth, but I think the road cycling application is moving fast towards detachable handles.

Image

A detachable handle can be locked in place at the end of axle (of course only one is needed on the bike) or put in a jersey pocket to save 1W of drag. Or replaced in the jersey pocket by the common L-shaped allen key, which is a bit less bulky. And even lighter by some grams. In my opinion the standard allen key may be even easier to use than the proprietary handle, if it is detached in the first place.
Last edited by Jugi on Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

jlok
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by jlok

I agree that it's not too good to buy stuffs purely based on what the pros ride. I also agree that bike companies try to relate what the pros ride to the consumers. After all it's up to people to choose. If they do buy the latest disc brake bikes like Madone and Venge for e.g., congratulations they look great! If you are a die hard rim brake, just don't buy. Your decision is respected.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 / BMC TM02 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

NickJHP
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by NickJHP

ome rodriguez wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 3:06 am
The pro teams can easily build a 6.8kg disc brake bike.
I don’t see many embracing the change in the peloton especially stage 17, you only see a handful using disc brakes. Even some bora and quickstep riders are on rimbrakes. The pros opinion does matter to me.
Better speed of wheel change and no potential problem with rotor of replacement wheel possibly rubbing on disc pad are the two principal reasons why pro racers are still using rim brakes, and until those two problems are sorted out, they'll continue to prefer rim brakes. The manufacturers also need to standardise F/R disc sizes. Some use 160/140, some 160/160, and I've seen a couple of 140/140, so neutral service has another problem there.

For myself, those problems don't matter. I don't change wheels in the middle of a ride, if I do get a puncture I don't care if it takes me 10 seconds or 20 seconds to remove the wheel or replace it, and if I have a bike on which I use more than one pair of wheels, I can easily shim the rotors if needed to make sure that all pairs have the rotors in the same location relative to the pads.

by Weenie


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