2017 'PRO' cycling discussion.

Questions about bike hire abroad and everything light bike related. No off-topic chat please

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maquisard
Posts: 1865
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 8:51 pm
Location: France

by maquisard

One team with a much greater budget that other teams isn’t benefiting the sport, it is stifling it. What have Team sky actually brought to the sport of pro-cycling?

peted76
Posts: 238
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:30 pm

by peted76

maquisard wrote:One team with a much greater budget that other teams isn’t benefiting the sport, it is stifling it. What have Team sky actually brought to the sport of pro-cycling?


Millions of $£ worth of exposure to the non cycling masses. Every year there are a gazillion sky vans driving round the UK with team sky plastered all over them.

IchDien
Posts: 252
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:23 am
Location: Veneto

by IchDien

They’ve also got people interested in cycling in the UK which really has improved the infrastructure and attitude for cyclists.

I don’t see murdoch pulling the plug any time soon. Some of my friends who work at sky say the upper echelons cannot believe how much publicity they get for such a small investment.

RTW
in the industry
Posts: 3191
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:32 pm

by RTW

peted76 wrote:
maquisard wrote:One team with a much greater budget that other teams isn’t benefiting the sport, it is stifling it. What have Team sky actually brought to the sport of pro-cycling?


Millions of $£ worth of exposure to the non cycling masses. Every year there are a gazillion sky vans driving round the UK with team sky plastered all over them.


Yes, as Pete says, exposure.

Team Sky have done wonderful things for cycling in the UK bringing (hundreds of) thousands of new cyclists to the sport. The 'class of 2012' is, in part, team Sky's doing. That injection of money to the industry that the sales here have seen has allowed for better tech and products for all cyclists.

This was the same with Ullrich and T-Mobile in Germany. It was the same with USPS/Discovery and Lance in the US.

Pro Sport is a business.

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euan
Posts: 1494
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am

by euan

RTW wrote:That injection of money to the industry that the sales here have seen has allowed for better tech and products for all cyclists.

FYI, there seems to be less money in the "cycling" industry than ever before. Looking beyond brick and mortar shops and manufacturers, if you look at the sport, two if not three domestic teams are winding up at the end of the year.

If there is more money from Sky's involvement its being kept by a small group of people and isn't filtering down.
"Step forward the climber and all those who worship at the altar of lightness" - R. Millar

maquisard
Posts: 1865
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 8:51 pm
Location: France

by maquisard

That is my point, it has driven up wages in an unsustainable way. That actually damages the sport as it prevents obstacles to other sponsors coming on board as they know they need to commit massive sums of money to be competitive.

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tymon_tm
Posts: 2368
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:35 pm

by tymon_tm

gangbang wrote:It looks like this

1 Froome suffering in Los Machucos
2 Team decided to increase a dose of salbutamol twice
3 Froome tested positive
4 Froome dominates a time trial
5 Froome confidently goes in Angliru


remember that Froome is a three time knighted five time champion and an Asthma Survivor, should we expect him to roll over and die? I'm sure he was just twice ill than he normally is and thus the SKY Certified Doctor gave him a proper dosage. is it his fault it happened that day or the other? just like with Wiggins, the illness doesn't pick! we should be happy the drugs allow them to race like normal healthy people!

/skyfanboyrant over
kkibbler wrote: WW remembers.

mrlobber
Posts: 641
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:36 am
Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

Rondje wrote:This says something else: https://twitter.com/RobicCoaching/statu ... 5485579264


Nice study, although I'd like to note that study subjects were "recreational cyclists" with VO2 max of 55ml/kg/min, which is quite a pathetic level (I know, because myself I'm at that one too) and nowhere close to any pro rider. As with some other substances, the responses in highly trained vs recreationally trained individuals might be different.

Edit: The Inner Ring has a deeper write on this: http://inrng.com/2017/12/chris-froomes-salbutamol-case/

Not related to quoted text: sad news, except for the Sky haters who will now roll on a higher wave than Bitcoin.
Last edited by mrlobber on Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ave
Posts: 1719
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 10:15 pm
Location: Hungary

by ave

If I understand well, we returned the extremely high levels in a test after stage 18.
This is one day after stage 17, where he was dropped quite a bit.

If he is cleared after this, this means everybody should be allowed to dope after a bad stage?

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tymon_tm
Posts: 2368
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:35 pm

by tymon_tm

IMHO everyone should be allowed to be asthmatic - just like in cross country skiing
kkibbler wrote: WW remembers.

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53x12
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2006 6:02 am
Location: On the bike

by 53x12

I knew this. Many of us knew it and got beat up by the Froome fanboys and the Team Sky fanboys. Team Sky and Froome are nothing more than the new version of Team USPS and LA. Just happy to have been vindicated.
"Marginal gains are the only gains when all that's left to gain is in the margins."

basilic
Posts: 662
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:05 am
Location: Geneva, Switzerland

by basilic

This is lifted from Wikipedia under salbutamol:

Doping
There is no compelling evidence that salbutamol and other β2 agonists can increase performance in healthy athletes.[26] In spite of this, salbutamol required "a declaration of Use in accordance with the International Standard for Therapeutic Use Exemptions" under the 2010 WADA prohibited list. This requirement was relaxed when the 2011 list was published to permit the use of "salbutamol (maximum 1600 micrograms over 24 hours) and salmeterol when taken by inhalation in accordance with the manufacturers’ recommended therapeutic regimen."[27][28]

According to two small and limited studies, salbutamol increases performance on endurance exercise even for a person without asthma.[29][30][31]

Another study contradicts the above findings, however. The double blind, randomised test conducted on 12 non-asthmatic athletes concluded that salbutamol had a negligible effect on endurance performance. Nevertheless, the study also showed that the drug's bronchodilating effect may have improved respiratory adaptation at the beginning of exercise.[32]

Salbutamol has been shown to improve muscle weight in rats[33] and anecdotal reports hypothesise that it might be an alternative to clenbuterol for purposes of fat burning and muscle gain, with multiple studies supporting this claim.[34][35][36][37] Abuse of the drug may be confirmed by detection of its presence in plasma or urine, typically exceeding 1000 µg/L. The window of detection for urine testing is on the order of just 24 hours, given the relatively short elimination half-life of the drug,[38][39][40] estimated at between 5 and 6 hours following oral administration of 4 mg.[18]


The similarity with clenbuterol is interesting

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TonyM
Posts: 2178
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

I hope that Sky UK and Froome will not damage this wonderful sport again!

But if Sky UK and Froome are cheating/ doping many will not be surprised.

In that case it should be done like a fast Brexit! Just get them fast out of the game.

Daniel1975
Posts: 206
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:46 pm

by Daniel1975

The UCI will damage the sport if they do NOT suspend Froome.
If there’s no Froome and a less doped Sky next season, races will be more interesting I think.

spud
Posts: 644
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:52 am

by spud

To me, this all goes back to Sutton's comment about TUEs being used to allow the cyclist to function at 100%. Problem is, the people with a vested interest are making the decision about when to use to get to 100%, including the team doctor. Their definition of 100% is different than somebody else's. I got dropped today, I must not be at 100% - sure that's right, by definition. But it may be because I am tired, or I have a little cough, whatever. Maybe the guy down the hall is depressed because his girlfriend just dumped him, give him an upper to improve his mood and allow him to ride at 100%. A very slippery slope.

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