2017 'PRO' cycling discussion.

Questions about bike hire abroad and everything light bike related. No off-topic chat please

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kkibbler
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by kkibbler

Not gonna harp on Sagan and Kwiato any more than what's already been said, however, I think Alaphilippe definitely has a WC in his future. He's versatile, punchy, responsive. Being able to follow Sagan's attack when so many couldn't speaks volumes.

nemeseri
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by nemeseri

kkibbler wrote:Not gonna harp on Sagan and Kwiato any more than what's already been said, however, I think Alaphilippe definitely has a WC in his future. He's versatile, punchy, responsive. Being able to follow Sagan's attack when so many couldn't speaks volumes.


Yep-yep! He is very consistently up there all the time! Really fun to watch that kid. I predict more Sagan vs Alaphilippe in the future.


Vagabond
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by Vagabond

Rondje wrote:Some say that because of that bike length Kwait could catapult himself over Sagan. Sucked into the slipstream and jump right over it.
I feel for Sagan tho, working hard every race, animating it and end up second so often.


I don't feel bad for him at all. He needs to be smarter. Towing a world champion and one of the sports future stars to the line isn't going to work out for him all that often. He's going to be marked now just like Cancellara was. Victories in the monuments will come much harder to him. Great race today and a great victory. I hope the cobbled classics are just as exciting at the end.
Colnago e Campagnolo

kauphy
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by kauphy

Very impressed with Alaphilippe. He effectively bridged the gap to Sagan alone. He definitely has a very bright future if he develops at this rate. Of all the French riders today, he's by far the most enjoyable to watch.

prebsy
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by prebsy

Some of these comments clearly are coming from people that have never had a chance to win/lose a bike race before. There is no pride in being the strongest man on the day and being out foxed... chapeau on a good ride Peter but seriously a tire length or a meter; kwait put away his second huge win of the season and it was well deserved. Why was it well deserved when all he did was suck the wheel??? Bc it's a race you do what is in your best interest to win not to look like a strong man.

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micky
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by micky

Did I watch another race?!?
Kwiato struggled to make it back to Sagan just before the start of the downhill.
When asked to work in the downhill he skipped it as he was trying to "recover" but then he was the only one helping Sagan on the final flat section.

nathanong87
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by nathanong87

kauphy wrote:Very impressed with Alaphilippe. He effectively bridged the gap to Sagan alone. He definitely has a very bright future if he develops at this rate. Of all the French riders today, he's by far the most enjoyable to watch.


dunno what you mean by 'alone' but he initially followed MK who was the first of those two, to react to sagan's attack and flicked alaphilippe through, then alaphilippe close the final gap. I'm not sure if it was the smarts of MK to ask for help, or if MK couldn't and needed* the help.

also, both MK and JA made at least one 'token' pull on the flats to via roma

crazy to see john D couldn't follow , and cobrelli were both literally blown off sagan's wheel.

prebsy wrote:Some of these comments clearly are coming from people that have never had a chance to win/lose a bike race before.


basically

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Samuel Sanchez Gonzalez
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by Samuel Sanchez Gonzalez

micky wrote:Did I watch another race?!?
Kwiato struggled to make it back to Sagan just before the start of the downhill.
When asked to work in the downhill he skipped it as he was trying to "recover" but then he was the only one helping Sagan on the final flat section.


Completely agree with you.

In the climb all three were going full gas.

In the downhill Sagan leaded all the way but sprinting after every laces, everyone basically doing the same effort.

At the 2km banner Kwiatek did a very strong turn in front, then a second one just before the flamme rouge to then let Sagan lead out the sprint.

nickl
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by nickl

Samuel Sanchez Gonzalez wrote:
micky wrote:Did I watch another race?!?
Kwiato struggled to make it back to Sagan just before the start of the downhill.
When asked to work in the downhill he skipped it as he was trying to "recover" but then he was the only one helping Sagan on the final flat section.


Completely agree with you.

In the climb all three were going full gas.

In the downhill Sagan leaded all the way but sprinting after every laces, everyone basically doing the same effort.

At the 2km banner Kwiatek did a very strong turn in front, then a second one just before the flamme rouge to then let Sagan lead out the sprint.


Yep, that's the race I saw too.

I don't understand what Sagan's critics think he should have done.

If he'd waited for the sprint I think he'd have been beaten. Gaviria beat him last week and was still there with teammates, and Kristoff beat Gaviria in this race. If you think Sagan made a mistake then you have to think he'd have won the bunch sprint, right?

So if we assume the attack was the right thing to do, then Sagan had to race it to the end. It's true that leading out a sprint at the end of the 290km race usually isn't a good move, but if he sat up both Alaphilippe and Kwiatkowski had viable teammates in the sprint. He had a better chance of winning by leading out Kwiatkowski and Alaphilippe than trying to force one though. Don't forget he beat Alaphilippe pretty convincingly.

nathanong87
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by nathanong87

for the comment about MK leaving a gap to coax PS into starting his sprint, that's one thing. In addition when he mentioned 'losing a few meters', i believe he's referring to dropping the wheel intentionally to sprint into PS's slipstream and accelerate past. Anyone who has played the sprint game in a race, or ride, starting a sprint directly on someone's wheel many times isn't ideal , but rather dropping the wheel slightly then accelerating. I distinctly remember gerrans doing this to griepel.

the only thing sagan did was mis judge the sprint, when i saw it live, at 225m ish.... i said to my dad , 'looks a bit early'. The attack, the small group dynamics, and him leading himself out, all were the right things and 'only options'.

glad the one guy from cannondale decided he could make the final group of MSR...
Image

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Mockenrue
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by Mockenrue

Rondje wrote:Also great picture of the sprint, 2 World champions and 1 potential future world champ:
Image
All 3 with a Garmin?


I bet Pinarello's marketing department will be dining out on this for some time.

nathanong87
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by nathanong87

Mockenrue wrote:
I bet Pinarello's marketing department will be dining out on this for some time.


lol ANY company would.

lets make more important inferences .....

ALL had white shoes + white socks and at good lengths. People take notes.
Last edited by nathanong87 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

spud
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by spud

Maybe I'm too negative, but in that situation, I'd say to Kwiato that he needs to work - Viviani winning the sprint? Not a chance. Step up and do some work, the worst you will get is third. But I wouldn't drag the guy to the line come hell or high water. Alaphilip with Gaviria, that's legit, I wouldn't expect him to work.

If everyone knows Sagan will always pull, then they can play the games.

Rondje
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by Rondje

Tactics are just as much part of the game as strength is. I feel sad for Sagan that he gets second again, but he should ride smarter. If Kwiato and Alaphilip go full out they'd never win from Sagan in the sprint, so they both did a small bit of work but let Sagan do most of it. It's not like the freewheeled in his wheel for 50km.

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