Anyone still have a steel bike?

[pnk]

+1 don't go for the Willier!

If you want a classic steel frame then get a real one there a lots of good offers everywhere even for nos, e.g. as already mentioned https://www.bricklanebikes.co.uk/frames-2 or use the 1k to by a modern steel frame, and Cromor = water pipes no need for using in bikes

[3phase]

The Black Friday Deal at Bike24 for the Ritchey Logic Disc was 700+ Euros something, I neary pulled the trigger on that one, but after some G&T over the weekend, I decided I will have a SwissCross

[shotgun1]

Was luck enough to try this out for a weekend. Sublime ride. This one has 25.4mm tubes, which are even slimmer than the tires that are running on it.

Cherubim Sticky from Japan

[ultimobici]

The Black Friday Deal at Bike24 for the Ritchey Logic Disc was 700+ Euros something, I neary pulled the trigger on that one, but after some G&T over the weekend, I decided I will have a SwissCross

Good choice!


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[schlafen]

I'm trying to get my first steel bike so need your opinions on this.
Ritchey Logic (was thinking of getting the disc or the limited edition)
or this Wilier Superleggera ?

https://www.merlincycles.com/wilier-sup ... 98905.html

Thanks

you can get a cinelli vigorelli for way less if you want cromor, maybe even disc for the same amount.
otherwise for about 1500-1800 you can get a Cherubim frame, which is a miles better and they are not made in taiwan like most euro-non custom frames, they are made in japan by cherubim.
don't be fooled, a steel fork does better at compliance than a carbon fork.
for the same amount you can possibly have a local builder to you build you a custom frame possibly, worth checking as there's nothing better than a custom steel frame.

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[ultimobici]

I'm trying to get my first steel bike so need your opinions on this.
Ritchey Logic (was thinking of getting the disc or the limited edition)
or this Wilier Superleggera ?

https://www.merlincycles.com/wilier-sup ... 98905.html

Thanks

you can get a cinelli vigorelli for way less if you want cromor, maybe even disc for the same amount.
otherwise for about 1500-1800 you can get a Cherubim frame, which is a miles better and they are not made in taiwan like most euro-non custom frames, they are made in japan by cherubim.
don't be fooled, a steel fork does better at compliance than a carbon fork.
for the same amount you can possibly have a local builder to you build you a custom frame possibly, worth checking as there's nothing better than a custom steel frame.

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True. Plenty of real frame builders out there making fairly priced quality frames.

Our frames are Italian built from start to finish. Custom geometry & custom paint are also available. Lugged steel from £1100, TIG steel with carbon fork from £1000.


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[DHG01]

The Black Friday Deal at Bike24 for the Ritchey Logic Disc was 700+ Euros something, I neary pulled the trigger on that one, but after some G&T over the weekend, I decided I will have a SwissCross

I actually had the SwissCross for a few months. Canti version in red. Great ride, very compliant, more so than the Road Logic, you ll get the springy feeling of steel.

I found the fork even more impressive. Stiff laterally, but takes up bumps and rough dirt very very well.

[schlafen]

Was luck enough to try this out for a weekend. Sublime ride. This one has 25.4mm tubes, which are even slimmer than the tires that are running on it.

Cherubim Sticky from Japan

Cherubim is top shelf stuff, up there for me with the big names, mostly before them.

I will own a custom steel Cherubim (at the office looking at a Cherubim desktop background as I type this huehuehue)

Their whole build style is just what I want.
Price is average for this level of build. I'll happily sell other bikes if I have to fund it.

Excited just thinking about it which is exactly what a bicycle needs to do in the first place, get you excited about riding it.

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[DHG01]

Excited just thinking about it which is exactly what a bicycle needs to do in the first place, get you excited about riding it.

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This is one thing I agree on.

[3phase]

great inputs from everyone! really appreciate it!

[DHG01]

Since we are in steel-gravel mode, my new BBloque. I posted full build and details on the intro section.
It's made out of Columbus XCR stainless tubbing.

I am delighted with the ride; similar to titanium.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=163768

Fortunately for us who like steel bikes, we have plenty of good options. My preference tends towards more modern steel; not as stiff or light as carbon, but stiff and light enough. Modernish geo, carbon fork; adequately speced, I will not be significantly slower than my carbon road bike.

The built above by BBloque was €1800 in XCR tubes, excellent welding using silver and built to my specs; other tubes should reduce that price significantly. It certainly excites me.

Ritchey, Standert, Genesis, Condor, Veloheld, etc. all offer great propositions, different tubes and price points.

Then there is the long list of excellent frame builders. I personally love the work of Amaro; the price point of a full build is also very interesting (probably because he lives in a hut and is more concerned on not seeing his frames on crappy builds than making money).

I don't share the sometimes perceived as dismissive approach toward "Taiwan build frames". A related debate, but different in attitude, is TIG versus fillet.

What I like from a frame builder is the ability to build to our specs. Then some have spectacular little details. Cherubim is certainly an example, and I can see those bikes getting a few of us excited.

Careful with some frame builders - a frame takes about 80 hours (with sufficient love put into it). When you see some frames become so popular, you may wonder who is actually welding (I am not being imaginative, just insight). Which is actually fine, the frame builder is supervising and the welders are experienced - but let's make sure we don't get too excited on bragging rights.

In the recent debate between the Ritchey Logic and the Willier, there is no right or wrong, but my impression was the SupperLeggera comes with some particularities - some might like the compliance of a steel fork, but it this case it is coming with a pretty short from tube and it has implications on the ride.

Not good or bad, but the debate and the different opinions help us all make better choices. The reason I now have a Standert frame is precisely due to reading different opinions in this thread a few years back.

[schlafen]

Since we are in steel-gravel mode, my new BBloque. I posted full build and details on the intro section.
It's made out of Columbus XCR stainless tubbing.

I am delighted with the ride; similar to titanium.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=163768

Fortunately for us who like steel bikes, we have plenty of good options. My preference tends towards more modern steel; not as stiff or light as carbon, but stiff and light enough. Modernish geo, carbon fork; adequately speced, I will not be significantly slower than my carbon road bike.

The built above by BBloque was €1800 in XCR tubes, excellent welding using silver and built to my specs; other tubes should reduce that price significantly. It certainly excites me.

Ritchey, Standert, Genesis, Condor, Veloheld, etc. all offer great propositions, different tubes and price points.

Then there is the long list of excellent frame builders. I personally love the work of Amaro; the price point of a full build is also very interesting (probably because he lives in a hut and is more concerned on not seeing his frames on crappy builds than making money).

I don't share the sometimes perceived as dismissive approach toward "Taiwan build frames". A related debate, but different in attitude, is TIG versus fillet.

What I like from a frame builder is the ability to build to our specs. Then some have spectacular little details. Cherubim is certainly an example, and I can see those bikes getting a few of us excited.

Careful with some frame builders - a frame takes about 80 hours (with sufficient love put into it). When you see some frames become so popular, you may wonder who is actually welding (I am not being imaginative, just insight). Which is actually fine, the frame builder is supervising and the welders are experienced - but let's make sure we don't get too excited on bragging rights.

In the recent debate between the Ritchey Logic and the Willier, there is no right or wrong, but my impression was the SupperLeggera comes with some particularities - some might like the compliance of a steel fork, but it this case it is coming with a pretty short from tube and it has implications on the ride.

Not good or bad, but the debate and the different opinions help us all make better choices. The reason I now have a Standert frame is precisely due to reading different opinions in this thread a few years back.

Good insight. Same thought process went into it when I found Cherubim and decided that this is what I want from a frame.

Yes I have ridden a couple of them, different materials, modern and vintage geometry. I do realise that the one I will get will ride differently, but I will be very happy with the result, if the ride will feel as close as possible to the vintage build I've ridden

I didn't mean taiwan built in the way perceived, but one can't express it very specifically. I meant standard cookie cutter frame built to a specific average geometry for a broad fit, size wise and weight wise.

Most off the peg frames are built to take weights of up to 110kg, average. If the rider only weighs 75kg that frame is overbuilt and this is a negative trait for a light rider the ride feel will be dramatically different. If the rider weighs 100kg it would be more suited for him.

This applies to everything of the shelf, steel, ti, alloy, carbon, bamboo etc.

A lot more goes into a custom frame than just the fact that is manually built by a person instead of a robot. People can do a bad job too.

Based on the riding it will do and the rider's weight and specifications, tube material tube thickness and geometry are tailored to that specific person, and ride quality will be 100% different for anyone else riding it.

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[DHG01]

timfound Cherubim and decided that this is what I want from a frame.

Yes I have ridden a couple of them, different materials, modern and vintage geometry. I do realise that the one I will get will ride differently, but I will be very happy with the result, if the ride will feel as close as possible to the vintage build I've ridden

I didn't mean taiwan built in the way perceived, but one can't express it very specifically. I meant standard cookie cutter frame built to a specific average geometry for a broad fit, size wise and weight wise.

Most off the peg frames are built to take weights of up to 110kg, average. If the rider only weighs 75kg that frame is overbuilt and this is a negative trait for a light rider the ride feel will be dramatically different. If the rider weighs 100kg it would be more suited for him.

This applies to everything of the shelf, steel, ti, alloy, carbon, bamboo etc.

A lot more goes into a custom frame than just the fact that is manually built by a person instead of a robot. People can do a bad job too.

Based on the riding it will do and the rider's weight and specifications, tube material tube thickness and geometry are tailored to that specific person, and ride quality will be 100% different for anyone else riding it.

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Looking forward to seeing that build. Cherubims are spectacular.

[DHG01]

Going back to different steel frame options. I had a peek into Condor's site.
Condor Fratello in rim brake version is €1050 delivered. Very good price for a bike in Columbus Spirit; plenty of colours and balanced road bike geo. Good alternative to a Ritchey Logic. I would've rathered shorter chain stays (the Acaccio gives you that) and a better fork. Still, very good option.

[ultimobici]

Going back to different steel frame options. I had a peek into Condor's site.
Condor Fratello in rim brake version is €1050 delivered. Very good price for a bike in Columbus Spirit; plenty of colours and balanced road bike geo. Good alternative to a Ritchey Logic. I would've rathered shorter chain stays (the Acaccio gives you that) and a better fork. Still, very good option.

Stays have to be that long to allow for 28c tyres & guards.

Try finding a monocoque fork that takes guards. No one makes one any more.


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