The wheelbuilding thread

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
alcatraz
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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

This is likely too much work for making a living, but for the amateur at home it shouldn't stop them from building an internal nipple wheelset if that's what they really want.

My rims looked quite uneven on the inside so I view them as an extreme case. I had to do the procedure maybe 5 times on the rear rim and 1 time on a front.

Another trick is to put pressure on the spoke near the rim entry to get a bit of angle advantage. Then only a minority of nipples need the procedure.

It helps to only do half/quarter turns until the very end so you know which way the nipples are all aligned. Saves time searching for the angle.

bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

Alcatraz, your post I hope puts others off from messing about with internal nipples. They can thank you later.

The solution you post should be sound though.why not use internal nipples that you can use hm washers with.

by Weenie


alcatraz
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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Never tried internal nipples with washers. The washer would seat crooked aswell wouldn't it?

I just used the Pillar 5r alloy nipples. There are probably better ones out there.

I don't know if the rims were extra nasty on the inside because of the reinforced spoke holes while being the superlight version (480gr 75mm clincher). The rim maker seems to do variable rim wall thickness and lots of different fiber directions to achieve this. Probably it's just due to bad compaction.

I have another 3 internal nipple wheelsets in the work queue, one of them deep. I'll report back any problems and added time afterwards.

bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

A washer allows the nipple to pivot more. It may help. In any case rather you than me. Good luck.

alcatraz
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by alcatraz

I've seen radial spokes with crooked nipples. I've seen nipples go the opposite way than the spoke entry angle in the rim. I'm looking at the spoke key angle with amazement sometime. Really odd.

I've concluded that the nipples go where they're led by the surface regardless where the spoke is coming from.

So I focus on the surface in the rim to solve the problem with crooked nipples.

Less pivot (no washer?) could even be beneficial if your rim bed hole doesn't line up with the spoke. You might need a tool though to "face" the nipple seat towards the rim bed hole.

Pivoting nipples may create a strong build with less stress and so, but if you can't build the wheel due to the angles then it isn't much use. I guess I'm building poor man's wheels where the rims aren't drilled with the intended angles.

iho
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Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:00 am

by iho

anybody has experience / recommendation with carbon spokes? Are they any carbon spokes that can fit a standard wheelset?

alcatraz
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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

iho wrote:
Sun May 10, 2020 7:06 am
anybody has experience / recommendation with carbon spokes? Are they any carbon spokes that can fit a standard wheelset?
I live in mainland china and I can't get a hold of any carbon spokes. I've seen a taiwanese brand (I believe they are) "ACM" and "Furay". ACM is not really available for sale, just seen them in wheelsets. I got a price of 85CNY for a spoke when I asked. Furay costs 35CNY for one. The weight of Furay is 2.9gr. None of them are bladed.

iho
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Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:00 am

by iho

Thanks @alcatraz. I am looking for carbon bladed spokes that are as strong as cx-rays but lighter. Most importantly, they can be fitted onto a standard wheel with off the shelf hubs (i.e DT swiss). Not sure if such a thing exists. As your righfully mention, most of the manufacters sell it as a wheelset and the carbon spokes are paired to a custom build hub shell.

2infernalwheels
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Joined: Thu May 07, 2020 6:22 pm

by 2infernalwheels

I am looking to make some wheels from some Mavic Aksium hubs i have and H Plus Son SL42 rims but not sure how I should go about measuring the hubs for spoke length. The front is normal straight pull and would be laced radially but the rear is radial on one side and two cross on the drive side where the spokes sit at 90 degrees from the axle. Not sure where to measure on the drive side of the rear hub? Please help!

alcatraz
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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Take a look at the dtswiss spoke calculator for straightpull wheelsets. Break out a vernier caliper and measure patiently. Measure two/three times if you have to. There is nothing more annoying when building than realising half way in that the spoke lengths are wrong.

For that calculator you need the ERD without nipples for the rim. (not hard to measure) Other calculators usually include the nipples.

Take your time. If you use thin spokes I reduce 1mm from the calculated values to account for spoke stretch (or a loose ERD measurement). Actually I reduce a mm no matter what the spoke and it comes out allright. Must be from the ERD measurement and not being able to stretch the spoke properly. Either that or the rim compresses. If I were lacing a shallow alloy rim with thin spokes I'd probably reduce with 2mm because of the stretch and flex.

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F45
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Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:08 am

by F45

I had a carbon rim with internal nipples. I bought the appropriate carbide bit and drilled that sucker for external nipples. I've ridden it on the back of my enduro mountain bike for a year with no problems. Best decision ever.

alcatraz
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by alcatraz

Are internal nipples on mtb wheels a thing? Doesn't seem very useful.

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F45
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by F45

No, that was a custom order that was my fault. I thought it would be cool and unique. lol

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WinterRider
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Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 2:46 pm

by WinterRider

bm0p700f wrote:
Sun Apr 26, 2020 11:41 pm

I wonder how quickly I would break those 754g wheels.
I would think that'd depend on how much wine you had consumed. :thumbup:
Litespeed 2000 Appalachian 61 cm
Litespeed 1998 Blue Ridge 61cm

Fitness rider.. 1 yr from seven decades age.

That is my story and I'm stick'n to it.

alcatraz
Posts: 3327
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

WinterRider wrote:
Wed May 20, 2020 12:58 pm
bm0p700f wrote:
Sun Apr 26, 2020 11:41 pm

I wonder how quickly I would break those 754g wheels.
I would think that'd depend on how much wine you had consumed. :thumbup:
Welcome back WinterR. I've missed reading your posts... :thumbup:

by Weenie


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