Glueing tubulars [the tubular thread]

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
MiddMan
Posts: 166
Joined: Sun Jun 07, 2015 4:54 pm

by MiddMan

I’m excited to be making the transitions to tubulars, and I’m looking forward to glueing them myself. However, as I’m having a reputable shop put together my build, I’m wondering if I should let them glue the first pair on?

First, does anyone have input on this? Quite frankly I’m crazy busy and will continue to be throughout the summer, so I’d rather spend time riding or with my family than tires.

That said, I have every intention of doing it myself when things calm down. But it would also save me the trial and error of making sure I find the right size, i.e., that leave room for frame and fork clearance etc.

Secondly, if they offer tape, should I insist they use glue?

Finally, I’ve read elsewhere on this forum that the base on new carbon rims should be sanded down gently with very fine sandpaper or similar material in order to “prepare” the rim for glue... True or false?

by Weenie


shimmeD
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Location: eNZed

by shimmeD

Why don't you ask your shop for you to watch the process? This might be a compromise to diving in blind.
Less is more.

Kurets
Posts: 149
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:55 pm

by Kurets

I certainly think you should insist on glue. Glue rolls better than tape, and the only reason to tape is convenience (which is out of the equation if you don't DIY).

If you are strapped for time, let the shop do it. Otherwise, do it yourself. The process is not that time consuming if you don't go overboard with the waiting.



sungod
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Location: it's raining, it must be uk

by sungod

glue

0000 or 00000 steel wool rather than sandpaper as you can make a pad that fits the rimbed better, the purpose is to mechanically scrub off any remaining mould release compound that might stop glue adhering properly

you mention finding the right size, do you mean for the tyres?

if you say what rims have you got, what type of riding etc., you can get some suggestions, my preference is veloflex and match the tyre width to the rim width + 1 or 2 mm

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Superfine steel wool? Hmmm, I use 180 grit sandpaper, blow the dust off and wipe clean with acetone on a new Campy Bora for example. And 180 is even finer than the 120 grit they recommend. Superfine steel wool would be like polishing it.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

Geoff
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Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2003 2:25 am
Location: Canada

by Geoff

The only time that I didn't glue my own tires, the rear rolled in a race, causing me to take-out my own sprinter. The mechanic who glued it was a real, pro from the 'old country', but something went wrong. I've never trusted anyone else to glue my tires since. Sure, it takes a lot of time to do correctly, but it is worth it for the peace of mind (not to mention the hassle that comes from crashing).

On the sanding of rims, the only actual scientific study of the gluing of tubulars that I have ever seen (Jones & Howat, University of Kansas/Kurata Thermodynamics laboratory) concluded thatnit doesn't actually work. I certainly remember spending a fair bit of time doing that over the years, though. I still do a lot of the things I have done by habit over the years (like aging tires), but sanding rims is something I have dumped from my proceedure.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Ha, yes but for carbon rims there are definite mold release agents to remove from a new rim and a bit of etching never hurts a bond surface. Don’t need a scientific study for that. I’ve glued new Boras with just a wipe of the rim with acetone. But since Campy actually advises the one time sanding of their new carbon tubulars with 120 grit paper, I tried it. Takes about 15 seconds and gives me peace of mind that I’ve removed all traces of stuff that might hinder a bond.
Now aging of tires on the other hand... the only aging mine get are just by virtue of having spares on hand for when I need them. Unfortunately, some are getting old by default. I’d rather have fresh. The rubber does harden up with time, but I don’t necessarily want to ride tubulars that have “hardened up”. I don’t have a puncture problem either way.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

Geoff
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Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2003 2:25 am
Location: Canada

by Geoff

Its funny. I have Conti Comps that have turned a reddish-brown colour as they have aged. They have a bit of a 'skin' on them and are nowhere near as 'sticky' as 'new' ones. I think that aging tires helps to keep things from sticking to the tread and eventualy working their way through the tire. Anyway, part of the tubular lore that I believe in. I need to stretch thwm anyway, so I may as well age them, too.

addictR1
Posts: 1367
Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:11 am

by addictR1

anyone tried this method before?

Lotto NL-Jumbo Team Mechanic mounts Corsa Tubular at Giro
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEfM_ySzKOM

reason i asked cuz last time when i tried to remove my veloflex on the side of the road.. it was so difficult and needed to use a plastic tire lever. guess i put too much glue on there. would like to see if anyone tried this method before?

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Ha... i believe he’s using Magik Mastik, cleans up with water (hope so because otherwise those brake tracks would be a supreme mess after that glue job. No concern for wiping the glue right into the spoke holes either. Haven’t used the stuff personally... too many reports of hit and miss results. And I wouldn’t necessarily use what the pros do re gluing tubulars as the best example of “best practices”. They’re under huge time pressure all the time.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

fdegrove
Tubbie Guru
Posts: 5858
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:20 am
Location: Belgium

by fdegrove

Hi guys,
addictR1 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:54 pm
anyone tried this method before?

Lotto NL-Jumbo Team Mechanic mounts Corsa Tubular at Giro
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEfM_ySzKOM

reason i asked cuz last time when i tried to remove my veloflex on the side of the road.. it was so difficult and needed to use a plastic tire lever. guess i put too much glue on there. would like to see if anyone tried this method before?
The method to mount tubulars as shown in that vid is nothing special really. The guy's using the latest Vittoria glue which allows for single layer mounting of the tub. It's not a contact type of glue that's all.
Too much of your typical contact adhesive is going to make it more easy to get it off the rim, not the other way 'round.

Cheers, ;)
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.

addictR1
Posts: 1367
Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:11 am

by addictR1

i use the Vittoria Mastik'One and last time i tried to spread it with my thumb it didn't go very well. haha. maybe it's my bad noobie technique. i ended up using acid brush to brush it on... guess just not thin enough as there were blobs here and there.

fdegrove
Tubbie Guru
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Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:20 am
Location: Belgium

by fdegrove

Hi,
addictR1 wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:43 pm
i use the Vittoria Mastik'One and last time i tried to spread it with my thumb it didn't go very well. haha. maybe it's my bad noobie technique. i ended up using acid brush to brush it on... guess just not thin enough as there were blobs here and there.
There you go, you are using Mastik One, the guy's using Magic Mastik. Different type of adhesive altogether.

Cheers, ;)
Being a snob is an expensive hobby.

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Calnago
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Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

@fdegrove: curious if you’ve tried the Magic Mastik? I haven’t and don’t know personally anyone who has... just read reports of use on the internet etc. If someone I trusted has actually used it and had good results I might be more inclined to give it a shot one of these days. Till then, Mastik One is my goto.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

beanbiken
Posts: 566
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:13 pm
Location: Great Southern Land

by beanbiken

Calnago wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:52 pm
@fdegrove: curious if you’ve tried the Magic Mastik? I haven’t and don’t know personally anyone who has... just read reports of use on the internet etc. If someone I trusted has actually used it and had good results I might be more inclined to give it a shot one of these days. Till then, Mastik One is my goto.
Have used the orignal MM and all good. Works [for me] as per advertisng and have now used MMP on 3 tubs, once again no problem except for clean up afterwards. Water clean up be blowed it is a s##t to clean up.............. Have never needed to remove a tire so I don't know what that side of the equation will be like [multi bikes and wheels]

BB
Ahhh, coffee & carbon

by Weenie


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