Glueing tubulars [the tubular thread]

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PinaRene
Posts: 853
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 12:08 pm

by PinaRene

Orange sealant works on butyl tubulars. Had a rear puncture this Monday, close to my house. Continental Competition was the tire. Wasn't a total flat in 10 sec. but more like 1 Km. 20 ml sealant and all was fine, so this tire can be worn out.

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velov
Posts: 454
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:09 am

by velov

Thanks guys.

Just one more question...do you guys carry a full sized pump? I've read mixed opinions about using CO2 with Orange Seal. And, if it comes down to putting on a spare then using a mini pump to get to ~120psi (for the minimal glue to work properly) would be a nightmare.

Geoff
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Location: Canada

by Geoff

I used to carry a full-sized frame-fit pump for decades. Since I almost never get flats, I have kind of gotten lazy and only take a minipump. The minipumps can put a pretty good amount of pressure in (enough to get home!) I can't imagine needing to put 120 psi in a tubular, though. I have never tried to use an inflator before.

KCookie
Posts: 1963
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Location: Pom living in Australia

by KCookie

velov wrote:Thanks guys.

Just one more question...do you guys carry a full sized pump? I've read mixed opinions about using CO2 with Orange Seal. And, if it comes down to putting on a spare then using a mini pump to get to ~120psi (for the minimal glue to work properly) would be a nightmare.
I always use co2, normally the punctured tyre will only hold about 60 psi but that is plenty to get home, or in my case I just keep riding.
I got home after a ride last week with only 40psi, rode like that for about 40km.
Was a soft ride. Image

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KCookie
Posts: 1963
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by KCookie

Kayrehn wrote:Ouch I feel your pain...

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Luckily Lightweight have said nothing to worry about. Doesn't need fixing thank good.

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LouisN
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Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 3:44 am
Location: Canada

by LouisN

Gluing tubular observation:
Just glued a new set of tubulars.
Continental Competition ALX Pro LTD 25 mm.
MAn ! This basetape litterally "drinks" Mastik One ! I spent nearly 1/3 tin on one thin layer.
Nothing to do with standard black Conti basetape.

LOuis :)

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PinaRene
Posts: 853
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 12:08 pm

by PinaRene

I used Conti glue on these... but you're right. For the complete glue job I've used two tubes ( total 50 gram ) of glue I guess, one layer on tubular and rim and then after 24h another layer on the rim. But they ride so much better than the Conti Competition with butyl innertube.

jlok
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Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Black gunk of glue developes on rear rim. Any idea why it doesn't happen on front rim? Shouldn't the Mastik One dry out and shouldn't be tacky like this?

Image
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Image
Image
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

Singular
Posts: 537
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:59 am

by Singular

Rear wheels are dirtier in general, I would assume that it is rim/pad residue.

Tubular glue should stay somewhat pliable and tacky to work. If it was rock hard (epoxy), it would lose all of its adhesion if and when the bond breaks (for example when heated enough). Tubular/contact glue softens and reattaches itself.

jlok
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Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Singular wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:16 am
Rear wheels are dirtier in general, I would assume that it is rim/pad residue.

Tubular glue should stay somewhat pliable and tacky to work. If it was rock hard (epoxy), it would lose all of its adhesion if and when the bond breaks (for example when heated enough). Tubular/contact glue softens and reattaches itself.
It's disc brake. If it's caused by brake pad dust then the front should also see the same thing but not in this case.

I had other tubular wheels in the past. The excessive Mastik One on the tire was hard and brittle and didn't turn black like this.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

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PinaRene
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by PinaRene

jlok wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:02 am
Black gunk of glue developes on rear rim. Any idea why it doesn't happen on front rim? Shouldn't the Mastik One dry out and shouldn't be tacky like this?
I think it happens mainly on the rear wheel is because of 70% of the weight of the rider is on the rear wheel. So pressure on the glue layer is bigger on the rear wheel. :noidea: ... but it's just a science thought.

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LouisN
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Location: Canada

by LouisN

My opinion is there is grease and/or degreaser involved in the drivetrain and drivetrain maintenance (degreaser or thinner will soften the glue).
Sooner or later some of it "flies" from the drivetrain and some goes on the sides of the rim, and "contaminates" the glue pouring out.
If you use a heavy "soap" to keep your tires clean, it might add to the "problem" too.
Louis :)

jlok
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Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

LouisN wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:50 pm
My opinion is there is grease and/or degreaser involved in the drivetrain and drivetrain maintenance (degreaser or thinner will soften the glue).
Sooner or later some of it "flies" from the drivetrain and some goes on the sides of the rim, and "contaminates" the glue pouring out.
If you use a heavy "soap" to keep your tires clean, it might add to the "problem" too.
Louis :)
I use paraffin wax as chain lube so I don't need solvent to clean my drive train.

Occasionally I use soap but they are not heavy nor strong.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

jlok
Posts: 2395
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

PinaRene wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:40 pm
jlok wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:02 am
Black gunk of glue developes on rear rim. Any idea why it doesn't happen on front rim? Shouldn't the Mastik One dry out and shouldn't be tacky like this?
I think it happens mainly on the rear wheel is because of 70% of the weight of the rider is on the rear wheel. So pressure on the glue layer is bigger on the rear wheel. :noidea: ... but it's just a science thought.
Yea it makes sense, but that doesn't explain why the black color instead of dark brown I have seen on my other wheels.

I think the Mastik One formula is the same between the tin and tubes?
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

by Weenie


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Alexandrumarian
Posts: 795
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 6:34 pm
Location: Romania

by Alexandrumarian

LouisN wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 2:02 am
Gluing tubular observation:
Just glued a new set of tubulars.
Continental Competition ALX Pro LTD 25 mm.
MAn ! This basetape litterally "drinks" Mastik One ! I spent nearly 1/3 tin on one thin layer.
Nothing to do with standard black Conti basetape.

LOuis :)
I wish vittoria, veloflex etc would leave it bare like conti, stop paiting that silly seal on the basetapes. I'd very much prefer to do my own impregantion with glue. When i tear a tire off a lot of the failure happens beween cloth and seal. Of course this prevents a failure in between tape and casing but these days most tubulars are removed to be binned not repaired. For a while i tried to sand / file / scrape the seal but it is too much work...

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