Latex Tubes - Better air retention with tubeless tape?

[jromano89]

I'm considering switching back to tubes, as I'm getting increasingly tired of tubeless setup/maintenance.

As I'm looking at some of the newer TPU options which seem to promise better air retention than latex, a thought occurred to me.... With properly taped rims and TLR tires, wouldn't air retention be much better either way? If there's nowhere for the air to escape, I'd think it would just stay in the tubes as they maintain their pressure.

I'll probably give this a test either way to satisfy curiosity, but wondering if anyone has experience to share.

[TobinHatesYou]

That’s now how it works. If you don’t use sealant with most tubeless tires, there will be a slow leak somewhere along the bead or at the valve stem. This slow leak is many times faster than the pressure loss from air permeating the wall of a latex tube so there will never be equilibrium inside the tire.

Basically in order for a tubeless tire + latex tube to offer slight improvement over just a latex tube, the tubeless tire would have to be very airtight to begin with. And in that case the latex tube isn’t adding much except rolling resistance.

Personally I’ll take tubeless setup/maintenance in a warm garage over being stuck in the cold rain with waning daylight because of more frequent flats.

[ghostinthemachine]

If you're needing tubeless maintenance, i'd guess you haven't managed to get the tire sealed to the rim properly, so changing sealant to a latex tube isn't going to help much, if anything it could make it worse (depending on the leakage rate from the tube into the tire!)

[jromano89]

That’s now how it works. If you don’t use sealant with most tubeless tires, there will be a slow leak somewhere along the bead or at the valve stem. This slow leak is many times faster than the pressure loss from air permeating the wall of a latex tube so there will never be equilibrium inside the tire.

Basically in order for a tubeless tire + latex tube to offer slight improvement over just a latex tube, the tubeless tire would have to be very airtight to begin with. And in that case the latex tube isn’t adding much except rolling resistance.

Personally I’ll take tubeless setup/maintenance in a warm garage over being stuck in the cold rain with waning daylight because of more frequent flats.

I see, that logic makes sense. Perhaps it's worth trying one of these new TPU tubes then.

If you're needing tubeless maintenance, i'd guess you haven't managed to get the tire sealed to the rim properly, so changing sealant to a latex tube isn't going to help much, if anything it could make it worse (depending on the leakage rate from the tube into the tire!)

It's less about the day-to-day maintenance, and more the added mess when rotating or swapping tires.

[rjich]

My tpu tubes tubolito are great. I can swap tires in under 10 mins and the pressure retains for weeks Vs my lightweight butyl. That has been the biggest advantage staying inflated. No need for tubeless for me atm. No punctures yet. I feel most punctures according to forums seem to be when installing with tight fitting tires with TPU tubes. On my Reynolds 21mm ir rims the tires go on with no effort really. Certainly no levers to pinch anything.with pathfinder pro. Gravelking and terra speed

[Butcher]

I used 5000 TR tires on my Easton wheelset [aluminum/tubeless ready] and no sealer. They held air for weeks. Your theory may work. I do not use those wheels regularly.

As much as I hate adjusting air in my tires every day, it does make the ride better since I am checking the tires out before I jump on it.

[TobinHatesYou]

I used 5000 TR tires on my Easton wheelset [aluminum/tubeless ready] and no sealer. They held air for weeks. Your theory may work. I do not use those wheels regularly.

As much as I hate adjusting air in my tires every day, it does make the ride better since I am checking the tires out before I jump on it.

If a particular tubeless tire/wheel combo holds air for weeks without sealant, then what is the point of using a latex tube? It wouldn’t add anything positive…just more weight and more rolling resistance. The rim would also likely leak air at the valve drilling because a tubeless valve isn’t being used.