Why OEMs use substandard bearing in top end hubs and wheelset

[cloud9blue]

Doing some end of the season servicing recently, noticed that rear hub on the Black Inc Sixty wheelset that came with my Factor One was noticeably more draggy than all my other wheels (DT240, Extralite, Winspace). The folks at Factor tried to help, but while waiting for them to wake up in their Taiwan/China timezones, I figure I rather take the matter in my own hands and took them apart. It looks like the stock Ceramicspeed bearings they used for my Black Inc rear hub were either overfilled with grease or have swollen seals that is causing the problem. Replaced them with some NTN bearings that I kept as spare for my DT240 hubs. Problem solved.

I also picked up a set of Farsport 35mm wheels built with Extralite hubs. The Enduro bearings that the front hub came with were crap out of the box. The race was too loose and causing noticable play in the lateral direction. But when you apply enough preload through the delrin microtuner, the bearings were notchy and won't spin as smoothly as they should. I replaced them with some NSK bearing from a reputable distrubtor and the problem went away.

Seems silly that these appear to be a common issue even on these expensive top of the line parts. I wonder how much Endro and Ceramicspeed are spending on marketing and discounts to be the suppliers. High quality bearings from NSK and NTN aren't really that expensive, for these bike hub sized ones, I can get them between $10-18 USD each. I am sure they would be much cheaper in batch orders...

[pdlpsher1]

I'm glad you got your issues sorted out with quality bearings. But it seems to me that most bearing issues are traced to the hubs rather than the bearings themselves. Poorly machined hubs will eat bearings no matter how good the bearings are. That's why I avoid hubs with sealed bearings unless if it's a DT Swiss hub. I have no experiences with Extralite or Winspace. Perhaps they are as good as DT Swiss. Other than DT Swiss I would trust Campy or Shimano as they don't use sealed bearings in their hubs other than in the freehub. You see, sealed bearings rely on an interference fit. The machining for that (the hub part) needs to be very precise. If the hole is slightly too large, too small, out of round, non-parallel with the axle, etc. the bearing will die an early death. As for replacement bearings I only use NTN. I've heard Enduro is pretty bad (from Hambini I think).

[ghostinthemachine]

Because they can buy a huge container of very average, but well marketed bearings for pennies each. Even better, someone else does the marketing (of the bearings) for them. All they need to do is add a couple of words to their press release.
Most customers have no idea who the high end bearing manufacturers are. Because marketing isn't aimed at cycling, the market space is too small.

Actually selecting the right bearing type/material, seals, lubricant type and fill from an industial bearing supplier takes time and effort and more importantly, doesn't actually add anything to the bottom line, especially for relative "newcomers" to the field. The old school players aren't (usually) reliant on that sort of marketing, so don't tend to play.

[usr]

From the consumer point of view, sure, 5€ more expensive subcomponents seem insignificant if we pay 100€ for the entire assembly. But, exaggerating a little, the manufacturer might have a materials cost of 5€ per unit, the other 95€ going to marketing, distribution and perhaps a generous dose of artificial scarcity. The better parts would, in this exaggerated (I think?) example double the materials cost! The better parts might still be worthwhile because shipping, ads, tradeshow appearances and so on wouldn't become more expensive from that (influencer giveaways, defect replacements and so on would), but it it becomes far more understandable why not everybody jumps at the opportunity to buy better parts: to those making the calls the difference is not a tiny fraction of street price, it's a considerably larger fraction of materials costs.

[Attermann]

I don't have enduro bearings in high regard, but a couple of them in my time pedals, they where completely gone within 500 km, without being in bad weather.

[Singular]

I don't have enduro bearings in high regard, but a couple of them in my time pedals, they where completely gone within 500 km, without being in bad weather.

But that can't be true. If so, that has got to be anything but the actual bearings causing it.

[Attermann]

then tell what has caused it, i only wash my bikes with a brush, and rinse of without much pressure, i have never had that happened to the other time pedals i changed bearings in.

[TribesMan]

Same here, Enduro bearing in my Farsports built wheelset, completely bust in rear hub after just 2000km.
Bearings were so worn that you could move the rime 2mm left to right when mounted on the bike.

Replaced them first time with another set of Enduro bearings, bought at Bike24 (I know I'm stupid, but they were cheap )...
The story repeated after 5000km.

Replaced those with some generic SKF stuff... no issues after over 20.000km. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[LeDuke]

Enduro = c-grade trash.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Cleaner]

then tell what has caused it, i only wash my bikes with a brush, and rinse of without much pressure, i have never had that happened to the other time pedals i changed bearings in.

If the bore and/or axle are not specified correctly and manufactured to spec then it can lead to premature failure of the best bearing. The axis of rotation alignment across the stackup as well as the interference fit of each bearing bore have a dramatic effect on bearing life. The major bearing manufacturers have well documented design guidelines and specifications, many manufacturers do not make parts that meet these dimensional specifications and result in poor bearing life.

There is a tremendous history of engineering knowledge and product development behind the design of bearings that most people have no appreciation for.

For those interested in learning more about it this is one example of documentation
https://www.schaeffler.com/remotemedien ... _de_en.pdf

[cloud9blue]

Got a reply from Factor/Black Inc "product manager". Personally I feel insulted by how much BS there was in his message.

[Mr.Gib]

Got a reply from Factor/Black Inc "product manager". Personally I feel insulted by how much BS there was in his message.

Something to be aware of is that some seals will give more drag, due to a tighter interface with the races. Seal drag while stealing some of your precious energy will make for longer bearing life. Depending on what you are doing with the wheels, extra weather proofing at the expense of a bit more drag might be the best move.

OK, what are some good online sellers of SKF and NTN bearings?

[cloud9blue]

I use these guys. Seems silly that I have to get them from France. But their price is fair and ships fast.

Havent found a reliable online seller in the States yet.

https://www.123bearing.com

[CyclingGiraffe]

Same here, Enduro bearing in my Farsports built wheelset, completely bust in rear hub after just 2000km.
Bearings were so worn that you could move the rime 2mm left to right when mounted on the bike.

Replaced them first time with another set of Enduro bearings, bought at Bike24 (I know I'm stupid, but they were cheap )...
The story repeated after 5000km.

Replaced those with some generic SKF stuff... no issues after over 20.000km. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Thirded (or fourthed?) on issues with Enduro bearings. Years ago I had a set of wheels made with White Industries hubs, which came with Enduro bearings stock. Within 1,000 miles, they were notchy and janky. I splurged on Phil Wood replacements (I believe at the time they were just Japanese-made NTN bearings stuffed with Phil's grease) and have had no problems in a decade since.

[TobinHatesYou]

Thirded (or fourthed?) on issues with Enduro bearings. Years ago I had a set of wheels made with White Industries hubs, which came with Enduro bearings stock. Within 1,000 miles, they were notchy and janky. I splurged on Phil Wood replacements (I believe at the time they were just Japanese-made NTN bearings stuffed with Phil's grease) and have had no problems in a decade since.

It might depend on which size, but all my Phil Wood bearings in the last half decade have been from NSK, and yeah they've survived a lot of abuse.