New Vision Metron 45SL first look!!

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pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

alcatraz wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:03 am
I'm surprised that 21h front wheels are a common thing now.

They aren't dished significantly to either side and thus they shouldn't really be triplet. A 21h front wheel has only 7 spokes on one side, just like a 14h wheel.

Would you descend confidently on a 14h wheel if you're a heavy rider?
The Roval Rapide I think are 18 spokes at the front.

pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

Taiyoto wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 2:39 pm
wider is good for aerodynamic, when I finish the first climb change to normal road, the speed can be more faster, me stable. But the hub is more incredible to get more climb force, but need to have 200Watts up to domain these wheels.
Did you check the weight? Was it really 1380gr? Is that with tubeless tape and/or valves?

by Weenie


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jlok
Posts: 2400
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Nice to see major brands catching up with small Chinese brands in the weight game. LightBicycle WR45 standard weight with Carbon-Ti hubs and 24/24 CX-Ray is 1409g.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

alcatraz
Posts: 4064
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

pmprego wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 2:45 pm
alcatraz wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:03 am
I'm surprised that 21h front wheels are a common thing now.

They aren't dished significantly to either side and thus they shouldn't really be triplet. A 21h front wheel has only 7 spokes on one side, just like a 14h wheel.

Would you descend confidently on a 14h wheel if you're a heavy rider?
The Roval Rapide I think are 18 spokes at the front.
You're right! I forgot about that wheel. It only has 6 spokes on one side. :shock:

And people complain about 24 spoked wheels being too risky because if you break a spoke you can't get home. :lol:

Taiyoto
Posts: 77
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:31 am

by Taiyoto

pmprego wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 3:12 pm
Taiyoto wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 2:39 pm
wider is good for aerodynamic, when I finish the first climb change to normal road, the speed can be more faster, me stable. But the hub is more incredible to get more climb force, but need to have 200Watts up to domain these wheels.
Did you check the weight? Was it really 1380gr? Is that with tubeless tape and/or valves?
only the rim of course, I use the Corsa Graphene with tube, it is a little heavy, but is ok for me.

nulldreiundreissig
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:13 am

by nulldreiundreissig

I feel like this the wheel I have been waiting for. Please tell us more about your impressions after a few rides, especially on the freehub and stiffnes.

pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

nulldreiundreissig wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 1:36 pm
I feel like this the wheel I have been waiting for. Please tell us more about your impressions after a few rides, especially on the freehub and stiffnes.
I guess you (and me) will have to wait for online reviews to start appearing.

Taiyoto
Posts: 77
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:31 am

by Taiyoto

first & second test use Aethos 8.2kgs. total bike weigth and the S4 test use F12 total weight is 9.5 kgs.

First test :

Image

second test next day

Image

today test with Ventoux S4
Image

the first ride and second ride was very impressive, the stiffness of the hub are very amazing, using a 72T, it is very good sound and very good for climbing. very very stiffness and faster reaction.

the second ride, the aerodinamic wider rim makes the descent incredible.

the ventoux s4 very impressive, good stiffnes because the carbon spokes, the hub low noisy, if change to CS will be great!!!

comparing these two wheels, S4 are more cheaper and enough to climb, The vision metron have the best hub of the world.

pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

alcatraz wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 4:34 pm
pmprego wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 2:45 pm
alcatraz wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:03 am
I'm surprised that 21h front wheels are a common thing now.

They aren't dished significantly to either side and thus they shouldn't really be triplet. A 21h front wheel has only 7 spokes on one side, just like a 14h wheel.

Would you descend confidently on a 14h wheel if you're a heavy rider?
The Roval Rapide I think are 18 spokes at the front.
You're right! I forgot about that wheel. It only has 6 spokes on one side. :shock:

And people complain about 24 spoked wheels being too risky because if you break a spoke you can't get home. :lol:
Two things:
An unrelated comment: there is a photo of an unreleased 1200'ish gr hunt wheel with 16 carbon spokes front :O

Any news regarding the vision 45SL?? On paper, these are a really interesting candidate for what I'm looking for but nothing besides marketing claims.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12456
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Taiyoto wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:25 pm


the first ride and second ride was very impressive, the stiffness of the hub are very amazing, using a 72T, it is very good sound and very good for climbing. very very stiffness and faster reaction.

I know this is months old, but why would high engagement be beneficial to road climbing where there is more-or-less zero coasting? Even if we’re talking about rolling terrain, you should be pedaling before the road starts tilting up again.

extrusionedwin
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:25 am

by extrusionedwin

I also have one metron, I can sure my point

At present, it is aimed at the climbing test. The total length of the climbing section is about 13 kilometers. There are two flat roads with a distance of about two kilometers. The entire section can be regarded as 10 kilometers for climbing. From 6% gradient to 18% gradient, the inertia of the entire wheel is very good, the conversion speed is also great, and the rigidity is sufficient for climbing, but it is not as good as the carbon fiber web. In the upper-middle level, it's a pity that the price is still not cheap. This time the hub should have the function of strengthening waterproof. For rainy weather, under low temperature and humid conditions, it can play the rotating speed very smoothly. This point FAR SPORTS VENTOUX S4 will become a serious fatal injury, because the hub is open. In this way, the inability to fully protect against the threat of moisture leads to early infiltration of moisture and triggers the operation of the hub. This is what we call a rust reaction. This really needs to be strengthened to improve the design of the hub to compensate for the entire rust. problem.

pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Oct 25, 2021 11:53 am
Taiyoto wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:25 pm


the first ride and second ride was very impressive, the stiffness of the hub are very amazing, using a 72T, it is very good sound and very good for climbing. very very stiffness and faster reaction.

I know this is months old, but why would high engagement be beneficial to road climbing where there is more-or-less zero coasting? Even if we’re talking about rolling terrain, you should be pedaling before the road starts tilting up again.
Don't reply to this user. Nor the one below your post. They are the same. He/she does have access to the material (or not... a copy, don't know) but his/her analyzis are no good.

petromyzon
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 4:14 pm

by petromyzon

The classic Shimano c24 shallow carbon laminate clinchers were 16fr 20r spoke count. Plenty of big riders on those back in the day.

I think there is plenty of market for wheels that are aero with 28mm tyres. Especially now that 28mm actually means 28mm and not 31mm. I'm pretty certain that for the vast majority of UK roads a 28mm is a better choice; even if I could be just as fast on a 25mm I wouldn't want to risk the rim damage.

pmprego
Posts: 2513
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

petromyzon wrote:
Mon Oct 25, 2021 7:45 pm
The classic Shimano c24 shallow carbon laminate clinchers were 16fr 20r spoke count. Plenty of big riders on those back in the day.

I think there is plenty of market for wheels that are aero with 28mm tyres. Especially now that 28mm actually means 28mm and not 31mm. I'm pretty certain that for the vast majority of UK roads a 28mm is a better choice; even if I could be just as fast on a 25mm I wouldn't want to risk the rim damage.
Yeah but these hunt are disc brake wheels.

tjvirden
Posts: 540
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:21 pm

by tjvirden

Nickldn wrote:
Sun Aug 01, 2021 9:55 am
That's the thing you see, I don't think that wider wheels are more aero, I think they are less aero.

We have been told wider tyres have a lower RR, so then you need wider wheels for the 105% aero rule. But when you get to 33mm wide wheels that means you can run 31mm tyres and still not break the 105% rule. Who is going to run 31mm tyres with 60mm deep wheels? That's a niche market. Gravel aero?

So why manufacturers are making these wide and deep wheels is what I'm trying to understand. What's the benefit for someone who uses 25mm tyres?
There's a balance to be struck. These new Visions are definitely optimised for a tire wider than an actual 25mm, so if you want to use an actual 25mm then it won't be ideal most of the time. What size of tire do you optimise for though? An actual 28mm on the front is now common amongst the pros. and perhaps for good reason. At Roubaix you now see some examples of a 32mm tire on a 60mm rim - niche for the pros, but it's still road, not gravel. Next year they'll be many 30mm tires at the Classics.

The 105% rule was really always a rule-of-thumb and it definitely doesn't give one perfect answer. Key to the new generation of rims is acceptance that shape (of the tire and rim as a unit) is just as important as actual size, generally with a yaw of more than about 5 degrees. Once you start looking at 12+degrees yaw and especially once the airflow is "stalled" at higher yaw, then handling becomes a real factor and that's where the fatter rim (at the front) really shines. Aero has many different "definitions".

by Weenie


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