Carbon Ti dissapointment
Moderator: robbosmans
- wheelsONfire
- Posts: 6294
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
You guys with this "issue", are all of you on Farsport rims and disc brake setup?
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓ Broad Selection ✓ Worldwide Delivery ✓
www.starbike.com
Looking at your spoke head....it seems to have 'pillars'? Like it is not a smooth conical surface? That would definitely make for a stress concentrator. Can you confirm?cberg wrote: ↑Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:21 pmSaw this thread and didnt think anything of it, about 15000 km with no problems. Then out of nowhere while standing in my living room my bike made a loud noise like when a tire sets into the rim and this was the result:
billede_2021-10-15_231610.png
Back to DT Swiss for my next wheels I guess
These were also with Farsports rims
Look at straight pull spokes online and they are usually smooth cone heads...
The shape of the head is definatly conical The spokes are CX-Rays, so I highly doubt those are the issuePugrot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 16, 2021 11:37 amLooking at your spoke head....it seems to have 'pillars'? Like it is not a smooth conical surface? That would definitely make for a stress concentrator. Can you confirm?cberg wrote: ↑Fri Oct 15, 2021 10:21 pmSaw this thread and didnt think anything of it, about 15000 km with no problems. Then out of nowhere while standing in my living room my bike made a loud noise like when a tire sets into the rim and this was the result:
billede_2021-10-15_231610.png
Back to DT Swiss for my next wheels I guess
These were also with Farsports rims
Look at straight pull spokes online and they are usually smooth cone heads...
The finish and countersink of the hole seems very rough. That could be the issue right there. I've got two wheelsets on Carbon Ti, both rim brake. Neither have very many miles. One Farsports, one LB, (and a second LB disc set on the way). Fingers crossed.
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.
Tbf some of it is just dirt from riding in all weather
-
- Posts: 573
- Joined: Sun May 06, 2018 8:30 pm
Have the same issue exactly on the rear ( drive side flange broke ) .
And it's beginning to crack in a longitudinal way next to a spoke for the front hub.
No farsports rims but boyd altamont lite rim brake rims. Bought nearly new second hands for cheap ( the price of the hubs new ) so 1/3 of what the first owner paid. Wheels were build by wheeltec nl, a quality wheelbuilder quite renowned in nederlands.
I put 5 to 6000Km before it broke; the first owner 1500 2000km I think
20 spokes front sapim cx super ray
24 rear mix of cx super ray , and cx ray '' classic "
wheels were really nice
been in contact with carbon ti
and they have been very responsive , I should finish the procedure and get replacement hubs from carbon ti it seems
don't think the wheels were badly buid , or overtensionned, i am 65 to 68kg 1m88 height , rode them in belgium and portugal.
me think it's a corrosion issue al7075 or lack of material .
will update you
And it's beginning to crack in a longitudinal way next to a spoke for the front hub.
No farsports rims but boyd altamont lite rim brake rims. Bought nearly new second hands for cheap ( the price of the hubs new ) so 1/3 of what the first owner paid. Wheels were build by wheeltec nl, a quality wheelbuilder quite renowned in nederlands.
I put 5 to 6000Km before it broke; the first owner 1500 2000km I think
20 spokes front sapim cx super ray
24 rear mix of cx super ray , and cx ray '' classic "
wheels were really nice
been in contact with carbon ti
and they have been very responsive , I should finish the procedure and get replacement hubs from carbon ti it seems
don't think the wheels were badly buid , or overtensionned, i am 65 to 68kg 1m88 height , rode them in belgium and portugal.
me think it's a corrosion issue al7075 or lack of material .
will update you
Did they mention if it is a fabrication/material issue or is it a design flaw of the hubs? If you get replacement hubs and the same design as the original, it is likely to occur again, no?romanmoser wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:09 ambeen in contact with carbon ti
and they have been very responsive , I should finish the procedure and get replacement hubs from carbon ti it seems
don't think the wheels were badly buid , or overtensionned, i am 65 to 68kg 1m88 height , rode them in belgium and portugal.
me think it's a corrosion issue al7075 or lack of material .
will update you
Here are some pictures of my two rear hubs. First hub 3 flanges went. This latest hub was one flange and I just noticed a crack on another. Like I said carbon ti sent a replacement quickly. Carbon Ti stands by over tensioning being the cause when I was communicating with them
The latest warranty replacement.
The original hub built by farsports.
The latest warranty replacement.
The original hub built by farsports.
I was thinking about too high tension as a cause of these failures and I am doubtful. If too high tension was the cause, wouldn't the failure occure pretty much immediately? OTOH If this is a case of metal fatigue than wouldn't a lower tension increase the amount of loading and unloading and the likelihood of failure? Just speculating. Either way Carbon Ti has a big problem (and so do I with three sets). Really hoping that there was some bad aluminum and failures will be limited to affected hubs. If it is a design issue the failure rate will be 100% (ultimately). A bit tired of getting cornholed by this industry.
@nickf, how the f*** do three flanges go at the same time. That's a wheel explosion. If that happens at the wrong moment on the road really bad things could happen. I think the US federal consumer affairs should be informed. They could force a recall.
@nickf, how the f*** do three flanges go at the same time. That's a wheel explosion. If that happens at the wrong moment on the road really bad things could happen. I think the US federal consumer affairs should be informed. They could force a recall.
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.
Lucky I was just out the front door when it happened. Literally all I did was clip in my left foot, heard a loud pop.
Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓ Broad Selection ✓ Worldwide Delivery ✓
www.starbike.com
Broadly, fatigue is a combination of the inital stress, the amplitude of the cyclic loading and the number of cycles.So in general, higher spoke tension exposes flaws in design or materials more quickly; it's classic "fatigue failure" here. Parts of the metal (where the spokes attach of course) are at a high % of the yield stress of the alloy once the wheel is built. As an example, perhaps 60% of yield stress; cyclic loading of aluminum alloys in this condition results in crack formation almost immediately. As soon as you use the wheels the crack starts and grows as you continue using them.Mr.Gib wrote: ↑Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:12 amI was thinking about too high tension as a cause of these failures and I am doubtful. If too high tension was the cause, wouldn't the failure occure pretty much immediately? OTOH If this is a case of metal fatigue than wouldn't a lower tension increase the amount of loading and unloading and the likelihood of failure? Just speculating. Either way Carbon Ti has a big problem (and so do I with three sets). Really hoping that there was some bad aluminum and failures will be limited to affected hubs. If it is a design issue the failure rate will be 100% (ultimately). A bit tired of getting cornholed by this industry.
@nickf, how the f*** do three flanges go at the same time. That's a wheel explosion. If that happens at the wrong moment on the road really bad things could happen. I think the US federal consumer affairs should be informed. They could force a recall.
Those three 'flanges' started cracking at about the same time and so when the first one let go, the stress on the others increased and so they failed immediately.
It could be that the alloy wasn't heat-treated properly (an impact test usually reveals that), or perhaps the design of the hub simply results in the stress in the alloy being too high once the wheel is built.
As far as I'm concerned, failures like this after a few thousand Km simply cannot be from "overtensioning". There's a fundamental flaw in the hubs.....