ENVE SES 2021

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TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12457
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

A 90mm or 100mm front can be quite a handful in the real world. I own a pair of 7.8s and have raced in tightly packed crits with them, so I know they are pretty good in the wind despite their depth.

by Weenie


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FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

That's always the trade off. I would buy a 7.8 front wheel, but I am completely expecting them to be updated within 6 months. Hopefully lighter, definitely claims about speed and stability. Probably best to discuss this once we have actual information.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

scapewalker
Posts: 261
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2019 9:21 am
Location: Austria

by scapewalker

I emailed them about a potential update for the 7.8s last week and this was their response.

"As far as we are aware there are no plans to update the SES 7.8 at any point in the near future.

Kind regards,

Rob
ENVE Saddleback Support"

CustomMetal
Moderator
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:14 pm
Location: UK

by CustomMetal

They have been wind tunnel testing new rims over lock down...
Allegra- Steel Lugs TBC
Aurelia- Stainless All Road 8.5kg
Bertha- TT 9.8kg
Perdita- Ti Turbo bike 8kg
Serenity- Ti Gravel 9.5kg/8.9kg
Verity- Ti Aero 8.2kg
Alya- Ti Climbing TBC

All weights with pedals,cages & garmin mount

Ride4Life
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:46 am

by Ride4Life

I was told 2 weeks ago, by ENVE, that they were happy with the 5.6 and 7.8 Disc and there were no plans to update them.

Based off this thread, that was a lie.

WorkonSunday
Posts: 540
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:39 pm

by WorkonSunday

i have my eyes on revolver tri spoke. seems like a happy medium (70mm) between H3 (50mm) and H3D (90mm). no idea about stability tho, still researching into it. If it doesnt work out it will probably be the Cadex 4-spoke.

would be awesome to see an ENVE TT/Tri front wheel. since im using Enve 6.7 and/or 95mm rear already.

Zipp, Camp, Roval went with deep rim with traditional spokes. While corima, Pro, FFWD, Cadex went with 2/3/4 spokes design. LW autobahn VR8 uses deep rim but clearly recognized traditional spoke count should be minimised. exciting time ahead. :beerchug:
Some say pour 10ml water out of your bottle to save that last bit of the weight. Sorry, i go one step further, i tend to the rider off my bikes. :thumbup:
n+1...14 last time i checked, but i lost count :mrgreen:

FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

Doesn't make sense to communicate too far in advance, because people will refrain from buying the current product.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

BdaGhisallo
Posts: 3261
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 1:38 pm

by BdaGhisallo

FlatlandClimber wrote:
Thu Jul 16, 2020 9:53 am
Doesn't make sense to communicate too far in advance, because people will refrain from buying the current product.
Exactly. Management will certainly not be instructing those interacting with consumers to advise them to hold off purchasing wheels because new ones are coming.

mothetgoo
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:50 pm

by mothetgoo

I am definitely interested to see what updates Enve has in store. I have a gravel frame being built right now and I was intending on splurging for the 3.4ar for it, but when the new Zipp 303 Firecrest came out, I went for that instead. I have always been an enve fan and I have two other pairs of enve wheels, but the new Zipps just seemed like too compelling of an option ($650 dollars cheaper, 50g lighter, still made in the USA, also a lifetime warranty). I think the Enves might still be nicer, I am just not sure if nicer enough to justify the extra cost. I am assuming (although maybe incorrectly) that Zipp will update its other wheels to follow the 303, and if it does, I am interested to see how Enve responds. I wouldn't be surprised if they also updated the other wheelsets (even ones that have been updated more recently).

CustomMetal
Moderator
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:14 pm
Location: UK

by CustomMetal

With manufacturing back log in the Far East looks like it will be beginning of 2021 by the time we see these on the road... it is a shame Zipp don't do rim only....
Allegra- Steel Lugs TBC
Aurelia- Stainless All Road 8.5kg
Bertha- TT 9.8kg
Perdita- Ti Turbo bike 8kg
Serenity- Ti Gravel 9.5kg/8.9kg
Verity- Ti Aero 8.2kg
Alya- Ti Climbing TBC

All weights with pedals,cages & garmin mount

Ypuh
Posts: 673
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2019 10:20 pm
Location: The Netherlands

by Ypuh

mothetgoo wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:32 pm
I am definitely interested to see what updates Enve has in store. I have a gravel frame being built right now and I was intending on splurging for the 3.4ar for it, but when the new Zipp 303 Firecrest came out, I went for that instead. I have always been an enve fan and I have two other pairs of enve wheels, but the new Zipps just seemed like too compelling of an option ($650 dollars cheaper, 50g lighter, still made in the USA, also a lifetime warranty). I think the Enves might still be nicer, I am just not sure if nicer enough to justify the extra cost. I am assuming (although maybe incorrectly) that Zipp will update its other wheels to follow the 303, and if it does, I am interested to see how Enve responds. I wouldn't be surprised if they also updated the other wheelsets (even ones that have been updated more recently).
What do you mean with update? Going wider, hookless and tubeless (as far as they haven't yet)?

I'm all for wider rims, but we kind of hit the limit for what can still be considered a road bike I guess. Enve is already on that limit, Zipp still has some room depending on each model. Disc wheels are developed a bit further at Zipp than their rim brake counterparts, but you might lose quite a few customers if all rims go hookless, 21c and disc only from now on. I'd expect the current 404 NSW to eventually become the new 404 Firecrest, like they did in 2019, but I wouldn't expect major changes before 2022 to not hurt current sales.

So my guess is, Zipp won't do any major updates for the next 1.5 years and Enve doesn't need to change anything, other than finding ways to produce cheaper.
Cervelo S3 - 7.3kg
Time ADHX - 8.7kg

mothetgoo
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:50 pm

by mothetgoo

Yeah, I think you're right on those points. I in my mind, the new Zipp 303 firecrest is an indicator of how the market is shifting. I have a new road build in mind that I am hoping to complete in the next year, and in my mind I wouldn't probably put anything smaller than 28s on it. To me, I would now view the AR line as a good "all around" road wheel. It seems like tire manufacturers are increasingly going down the hookless road to the point where I am totally happy with my circa 2018 3.4 rims now, but I would likely not invest the money in another set of hooked bead tubeless rims.

While I personally feel that wider, tubeless tires have been the single best development in road cycling during my lifetime, it is totally possible that I have just bought in to the latest trend and more people than I think are still committed to running 23c tires with tubes.

I guess I was also just assuming that Zipp had more updates coming, as I feel like the 303 update makes some of their other wheels a lot less compelling (IDK why you would spend twice as much for a heavier 303nsw at this point, for example).

I guess overall though most of my wondering has to do with price. Obviously Enve is a premium brand and I have bought their products happily in the past, but I do feel like the pricing of the new 303 firecrest puts pressure on Enve in a way that I didn't think was there before (and I say that as someone who recently bought the new 303 firecrest having intended to purchase the 3.4ar but, once the new Zipps came out, felt that the price on the Zipps was just too good).

kode54
Posts: 3749
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

ajcav86 wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:38 pm
With manufacturing back log in the Far East looks like it will be beginning of 2021 by the time we see these on the road... it is a shame Zipp don't do rim only....
Isn't Enve's manufacturing in the US?
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CustomMetal
Moderator
Posts: 1293
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:14 pm
Location: UK

by CustomMetal

kode54 wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 6:24 pm
ajcav86 wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 3:38 pm
With manufacturing back log in the Far East looks like it will be beginning of 2021 by the time we see these on the road... it is a shame Zipp don't do rim only....
Isn't Enve's manufacturing in the US?
Just going on what I have been told.. though when they said issues with manufacturing they could of meant the US as Covid is rampant there..
Allegra- Steel Lugs TBC
Aurelia- Stainless All Road 8.5kg
Bertha- TT 9.8kg
Perdita- Ti Turbo bike 8kg
Serenity- Ti Gravel 9.5kg/8.9kg
Verity- Ti Aero 8.2kg
Alya- Ti Climbing TBC

All weights with pedals,cages & garmin mount

Ypuh
Posts: 673
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2019 10:20 pm
Location: The Netherlands

by Ypuh

mothetgoo wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:54 pm
While I personally feel that wider, tubeless tires have been the single best development in road cycling during my lifetime, it is totally possible that I have just bought in to the latest trend and more people than I think are still committed to running 23c tires with tubes.
I think you're mildly exagerrating in you believes, but I can understand.

It also depends on your circumstances. Me for example, I have 2 road bikes, one with 21mm wide rims and 28mm tubeless tyres and another with regular 24mm tyres on 16.25mm rims (and a few more wheelsets in different configurations). I can tell you the latter is by far my favourite, but we do live in a flat country with almost perfect roads and I don't go offroad. The 28mm's feel squishy when going fast and since the hype died down a little, I'm kind of done with tubeless and back to running tubes. Haven't missed tubeless for a day. Similar with discs. They're nice, but it's not as night and day revolutionary as many people make you believe. I'm still doing long rides (200km) comfortably and beating my friends on both the climbs and descents whilst getting home safely.

If you put a gun to my head and ask me what bike I would buy right now, it'd probably have like a BMC Roadmachine with the new wider Zipps or Enve 3.4AR wheels and tubeless 28mm road tyres and discs*. The main fact being that it offers a significantly different riding experience to my full aero Cervelo S3. I'd probably ride both equally, just different horses for different courses. It's like comparing a Mercedes vs. driving a Ferrari. Sure you can drive a Mercedes really fast or a Ferrari really slow, but both offer a vastly different experience.


*the gun ain't necessary but is added for drama
Cervelo S3 - 7.3kg
Time ADHX - 8.7kg

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
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