Is there a better aero wheel than a Campy Ultra 50 out there?

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
audioblazer
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:09 pm

by audioblazer

I have both bora 35 & 50 non AC3 tubular . I prefer bora 50 . It holds speed much better. Weight penalty not much issue . However , cross wind effect noticeable

snowdevlin
Posts: 183
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:51 pm

by snowdevlin

And if choosing clinchers, would the "old" Ultras profile still be better then the new WTO 60mm?

by Weenie


Catagory6
Posts: 366
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:36 am

by Catagory6

instead of starting a new thread i thought i would just tack on to this one
reading about these wheels has me salivating
as someone who's never ridden carbon wheel, or a medium/deep profile wheel, or a tubular wheel, what might i expect going from a HED Belgium + / DT240 to a Bora One 35 tubular (i think 50 is a little too ostentatious for my humble sensibilities... unless someone can convince me? they're also quite a bit more expensive)

i will not be riding these in wet conditions.
terrain is rolling, with some steep climbs (15%) and twisting descents. and speeds kept under 50 mph

unfortunately i don't have the option to test ride

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pdlpsher1
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Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

If you are going all in with the Bora you might as well get the 50. They are fast and incredibly light for the depth. You only live once. Throw away your humble sensibilities. The 50s are great for climbing and rolling terrain.


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Calnago
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Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

Catagory6 wrote:...
as someone who's never ridden carbon wheel, or a medium/deep profile wheel, or a tubular wheel, what might i expect going from a HED Belgium + / DT240 to a Bora One 35 tubular (i think 50 is a little too ostentatious for my humble sensibilities... unless someone can convince me? they're also quite a bit more expensive)

i will not be riding these in wet conditions.
terrain is rolling, with some steep climbs (15%) and twisting descents. and speeds kept under 50 mph
You will like the 35’s. Funnily enough, the profile is very similar to the HED Belgium’s, just nice carbon. And the hubs are much nicer than the DT240’s, with better geometry. They will just be a really nice wheelset, although the Belgium’s are great rims too. Especially in the tubular version, you’ll be very happy. I have both 35’s and 50’s in all the various iterations of Boras since 2010, and they’re all still going strong. Have also had a set of HED Belgium’s laced to a powertap hub (rear) and DT190 hub front with aerolite spokes. The rims were great but never did like the powertap hub.
Anyway, both the 35 and 50’s are great, probably I’d give the nod to the 35’s for overall rideability. I’d say the difference between the 35’s or 50’s should be based on the look you prefer more than whether one is more aero than the other. And in the hills, in gusty conditions, the lower profile (of any wheel) is always going to feel better then the higher profile.
Oh, and I wouldn’t even worry one bit about riding them in the rain or wet conditions, especially if it’s not going to be a regular occurrence (commuting). They brake very well in all conditions and the carbon brake tracks will outlast alloy brake tracks by a good margin, regardless of the abuse you throw at them.
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alcatraz
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Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

If you're averaging speeds over 30km/h then 50mm is up your alley. If you're around 30 or below then 38mm are great.

Get the width your need. Don't put wide tires on a narrow rim.

If you're skinny you can ride narrow italian wheels but if you're heavier then you'll probably be faster on wide rims. It's not a one size fits all.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Sounds like @Catagory6 is going with tubulars, in which case throw that “narrower than the rim” tire stuff out the window. The rims are really optimized around a 25mm tubular, but if you want to go bigger (like a Vlanderen) they’re perfectly fine. Trying to glue a narrower tubular onto a rim bed with a larger radius creates a situation where, when inflated, the edges of the tire are constantly wanting to tear away from the rim bed, and the edges where the tire leaves the rim are where you want a very good bond; it’s far more important than the bond in the center of the rim bed. Tubulars are always going to take on a round shape. They are not like clinchers which, depending on tire size and rim width, may be able to be forced straight up from the clincher rim’s sidewall. So, a properly fitting tubular will almost always extend beyond the rims brake track a bit, which also serves to protect the rim from abrasions from curbs, etc.
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Catagory6
Posts: 366
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:36 am

by Catagory6

so... damn... tempted...

generally average over 30 kps over the rollers, but would still go for the 35s

Roadrocket
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:43 am
Location: Slovakia

by Roadrocket

Get Bora 50 tubular, you´ll thank me later.
Very light(about 1200g), fast, aero and quite stable in crosswinds. They climb great too and are probably stiffer than 35s due to higher profile. Great allrounders, I´ll probably never sell my Ultras, even if wider version would be introduced.
I´ve had One 50s too and they were even slightly lighter than Ultra 50.
I found great deal for Ultras, otherwise I would be still riding the One 50s. Both the same wheels except the hubs.

Catagory6
Posts: 366
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:36 am

by Catagory6

pdlpsher1 wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 12:59 am
If you are going all in with the Bora you might as well get the 50. They are fast and incredibly light for the depth. You only live once. Throw away your humble sensibilities. The 50s are great for climbing and rolling terrain.


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Roadrocket wrote:
Sun Jun 02, 2019 5:45 pm
Get Bora 50 tubular, you´ll thank me later.
Very light(about 1200g), fast, aero and quite stable in crosswinds. They climb great too and are probably stiffer than 35s due to higher profile. Great allrounders, I´ll probably never sell my Ultras, even if wider version would be introduced.
I´ve had One 50s too and they were even slightly lighter than Ultra 50.
I found great deal for Ultras, otherwise I would be still riding the One 50s. Both the same wheels except the hubs.

c’mon you 2, please dont confuse and tempt me any more than i already am.

Daveaero
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:56 pm

by Daveaero

cyclespeed wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 3:14 pm
I´ve been using Campa BoraUltra 50 for 18 months now and really like them.

Light, aero, roll really nicely, smooth, stiff, etc.etc.

I need another set of wheels for my other bike / project. Do I just double up and buy them again? Or is there something else out there worth considering?

I´ve used Lightweight Meilensteins, Mavic Ultimate CCU, Corima MMC47S, DTSWiss 45, Enve 28, etc.

Not too keen on Zipp.
Well, if you have a kideny to spare GET THE NEW FENWEG..all i can say is Damn!

Zorka
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2018 9:20 am

by Zorka

cyclespeed wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 11:13 am
Roadrocket wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 11:10 am
The only downside I can see is that I must use 23mm tyre on the front because of narrow rim profile. Otherwise they are perfect, stiff, fast, aero, great ceramic hubs, very stable on crosswinds.
I'm using Vittoria CX 25mm tubs front and rear on mine and I would say the rim is wide enough for these to be aero. Certainly, looking down the side of the wheel, the tyre is nice and flat to the rim.

And I fill up the space between rim and tyre with silicone, but that is a different story.....!

May I ask you for the pics of your wheels with the silicone upgrade? Can you feel it´s faster, or any other advantage?
Thx

torger
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:45 am

by torger

I guess it depends on what we mean with "better".

If an aero wheel is supposed to be slippery in the wind, there are quite many faster wheels out there as the Boras is an older design. Tubs don't have as low rolling resistance as the best tubeless clinchers, but I guess there are some latex-tubed tubs that are close. The differences between rims of the same depth is quite marginal as well, and if you use a properly narrow tire for the narrow rim and ride on smooth tarmac, it will be very fast.

If you want fastest possible today I'd look for something a bit wider and tubeless (with GP5000 TL tires), rather than narrow tubular. It would be interesting to see an independent test compare Campys new WTO 45 with tubeless compared to Bora 50 tubs. The deeper rim is in favour for the Boras, the more modern aero profile and tubeless tires is in favour for the WTOs. Riding speed and surface will matter too. Smoother surface and higher speeds will probably be in favor for the Boras. And of course, the Bora 50 tubs are very light for an aero wheel, so if that is a consideration it is a winner.

Also worth considering is that Campy doesn't design the wheels to be fastest possible in a straight line, but to be versatile racing wheels, to be efficient in typical racing conditions, cross winds etc. Those aspects are hard to measure in a lab. I don't have too much experience with various aero wheels, but I do have a Bora Ultra wheelset and I was surprised how well it handled crosswinds. The winds are felt, but it must be really crazy winds before I would consider them be too unstable to ride.

Catagory6
Posts: 366
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:36 am

by Catagory6

you dirty dogs better be right about this
now i'm gonna need suggestions for tires
can't believe i just did that.
365-day return policy... ok
guess i gotta put up a bunch of stuff up on the sleaze-bay now to make some room

by Weenie


addictR1
Posts: 1657
Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2012 1:11 am

by addictR1

Catagory6 wrote:
Sun Jun 02, 2019 10:25 pm
c’mon you 2, please dont confuse and tempt me any more than i already am.
don't worry.. you're not the only one. i'm tempted to get the bora 50 as well... just not sure if ultra is worth it or would the 50 one be just as good. but right now i have my reynolds aero 46/72 in tubs... i'm on the fence...

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