Notching issues with aluminum freebub bodies

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Multebear
Posts: 1395
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

Maybe we should have a topic to address this issue directly instead of going off topic in other peoples topics regarding hubs in general.

I have this issue with all my hubs that have aluminum freehub bodies. I ride Shimano cassettes only. Mostly 105 and Ultegra cassettes. The hubs that I've had this issue with are:

- Chris King R45
- DT Swiss 240s
- Miche Primato Syntesi

After having these problems, I stopped buying more of those hubs for further wheelbuilds. The hubs that I own, that don't have this issue, are:

- Shimano Dura Ace (titanium freehub body)
- Shimano 105 (steel freehub body)
- White Industries T11 (titanium freehub body)

I bought a steel freehub body for my DT Swiss 240s hub, and after a couple weeks use, it seems the problem has gone away.

For me it isn't a solution to ride Sram cassettes. There are several reasons for this.

- I do a lot of training and winter training in northern europe. We have a lot of rain, and I'm not gonna waste money on expensive Sram cassettes, that come in one piece to avoid the problem, since this weather wears cassettes down faster than in sunny places.
- I ride Shimano, and I like Shimano. I've never ridden Sram and it's never going to happen either.
- I find the problem to be in the design of the non-Shimano hubs, not in the Shimano cassettes. As mentioned above, I've never had this problem with Shimano hubs.

I know a lot of people who ride DT hubs. They are very popular in this region. All of them have this problem as well. Asking my LBS and googling around confirms, that the problem is worldwide with aluminum freehub bodies. Even fairwheelbikes in their hub review mention the problem, without offering any other solutions than buying hubs with titanium or steel freehub bodies (it's mentioned in the review of the WI T11 rear hub):

http://blog.fairwheelbikes.com/reviews- ... ub-review/

I asked my LBS what the solutions are, and they just asked me why I would be so "careless" and ride anything else than Shimano hubs with my Shimano cassettes.

I'm aware, that some people claim, that using a torque wrench to tighten the cassette lockring will solve the problem. I just don't have any faith in this suggestion:

1) First of all I don't own a torque wrench for cassette lockrings. I don't even know anyone who does. My LBS don't have one and never use one to tighten their costumers lockrings. And I consider them to be very skilled, and they are (I know you are going to disagree here @bm0p700f). I visit their shop because they have the best mechanic in my city. I don't even ride their brand bikes.

2) I always tighten my lockrings to the point where it's very hard to remove it again. I don't think I'm below 40 nm which is recommended. If I am below 40 nm and need to tighten it even more, then I'm to weak to ever remove it again and a torque wrench wouldn't help me, it would only make me tighten the lockring so much, that it would be stuck.

3) There is a limit to how many tools I'm willing to pay for. Mounting and unmounting cassettes is not a job, that is supposed to require expensive tools, who are not mechanics or shop owners. And this doesn't make me a bodger. And in the kind of weather I'm riding 7-8 months a year, I often have to remove the cassette after each ride in order to clean it. If this job requires me buying a torque wrench, then I'm running the wrong hub. And this is to bad, because I very much like my Miche Primato and Chris king hubs, but I just find the design to be too focused on saving weight on the freehub body, instead of just designing something, that works for everyone.

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pdlpsher1
Posts: 4016
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

I run Campy wheels with Shimano freehubs and Shimano cassettes. No notching issues here. The Campy freehub has a plasma treatment that makes the surface harder. But most importantly I don’t sprint. I don’t see max power of more than 600w. And I weigh 62kg. I wonder if other Campy wheel users see any notching issues.


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Multebear
Posts: 1395
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

pdlpsher1 wrote:
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:01 pm

I wonder if other Campy wheel users see any notching issues.
They don't. But that's because the campy freehub body design is different. The grooves (don't know the exact english term for this) are deeper, and thus the contact area for the cassettes is much bigger.

I ran campy for several years before I moved to Shimano, when I couldn't find a mechanical 11 speed campy super record system that shiftet perfectly 20 out of 20 times.

joejack951
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by joejack951

Image

Image

Plenty of 'solutions' to the problem of loose sprocket cassettes biting into aluminum freehub bodies. In my experience, a fully tightened cassette lockring won't allow this to happen anyway, but most people would never tighten their lockrings that tight (not that it is all that tight in the grand scheme of things).

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pdlpsher1
Posts: 4016
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:09 pm
Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

I meant Campy wheels with Shimano freehubs. I don’t recall seeing any complaints about notching. Maybe the plasma treatment is a good solution.


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vejnemojnen
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2013 7:11 pm

by vejnemojnen

googling for the freehub body spline damage, I've got an interesting hit:

https://www.huckingkitty.com/forums/vie ... ?f=12&t=68

Multebear
Posts: 1395
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

vejnemojnen wrote:
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:51 pm
googling for the freehub body spline damage, I've got an interesting hit:

https://www.huckingkitty.com/forums/vie ... ?f=12&t=68
I've seen this solution a couple times. Maybe this works as a short term solution, but seriously - why would someone make a product where solutions like these are necessary? I would be embarrest, if I were the manufacturer of this product.

sungod
Posts: 1702
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 9:37 pm

by sungod

this was done to death on the other thread

if you want to use shimano/similar cassettes, don't put them on an al fhb, they'll gouge it

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vejnemojnen
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2013 7:11 pm

by vejnemojnen

btw, campag freehubs are THOUGH.

I've been running an 8spd cassette on 10spd body for 1 year (pretty much analogous to separate cog steel cassette on shallow alloy freehub splines)

zero issues. barely noticeable indentation

I guess their sh-sram splined freehubs are from the very same material..

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iamraymond
Posts: 624
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:59 am

by iamraymond

I was browsing CyclingTIps Interbike 2018 album and I saw this solution from Onyx to prevent the freehub from notching on DT swiss hubs.

Image

Source: https://cyclingtips.com/2018/09/interbi ... ts-galore/

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