Bora WTO

Everything about building wheels, glueing tubs, etc.
jlok
Posts: 1386
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Use a spanner to hold the preload lock ring on NDS (make sure to use a cloth or something to cover the preload ring not to scratch it).
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

flying
Posts: 2380
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2005 9:16 am

by flying

Cycomanic wrote:
Sat Jun 13, 2020 8:36 pm
On another note, does anyone know which instructions to use for hub maintenance for the WTOs?
I do not know but...I would caution to look at this which is for all newer Bora, Bora Ultra, Shamal & Zonda wheels

While bearing disassemble etc is the same the one big difference is to not
use two hex wrenches as before/older instructions showed

The reason is the non adjustable side is no longer a fixed bolt & if it comes loose you cannot get the more important adjustable side off
so you cannot remove the axle

So, be sure to use a wrench on the non adjustable side leaving that bolt on

Here is a bulletin Campy Support sent me.
Attachments
new hubs disassembly.jpg

by Weenie


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pdlpsher1
Posts: 2849
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Location: CO

by pdlpsher1

The first time I disassembled the front wheel I hadn't seen the service bulletin. I used two hex wrenches and the nut on the non-adjustable came out. I ended up damaging the axle. Now I've learned by mistake. Since then I've helped a few friends service their Bora wheels using the correct method and had no issues. I don't know why Campy torqued the nut on the adjustable side so tightly. Once I get that nut off I put some grease over the threads and that will help from getting frozen.

jlok
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Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

https://www.campagnolo.com/NL/en/Support/download

more hints here. try to refer to those technical manuals for bora one db.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

Chuck
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:50 am

by Chuck

Probably a dumb question, would the deeper section and shorter spokes of the 45&60 be stiffer than the 33? I'm about 100kg/220. I like the look of shallower rims on my Bianchi Specialissima but on a previous brand new bike my derailleur went into my shamal milles on a steep ascent, broke off the derailleur and spun it around to crack the seat stay. Either the bike shop didn't set the derailleur right or my fat ass warped the wheel with some serious flex. I still have the shamals but am nervous about going into the lowest gear. Being bigger I'm not worried about cross winds, and being a novice aero gains from the 33 to 45 or 60 are lost on me. The since repaired bike now has bora 50s which are fantastic.

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zappafile123
Posts: 496
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:24 am

by zappafile123

Chuck wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:13 am
Probably a dumb question, would the deeper section and shorter spokes of the 45&60 be stiffer than the 33? I'm about 100kg/220. I like the look of shallower rims on my Bianchi Specialissima but on a previous brand new bike my derailleur went into my shamal milles on a steep ascent, broke off the derailleur and spun it around to crack the seat stay. Either the bike shop didn't set the derailleur right or my fat ass warped the wheel with some serious flex. I still have the shamals but am nervous about going into the lowest gear. Being bigger I'm not worried about cross winds, and being a novice aero gains from the 33 to 45 or 60 are lost on me. The since repaired bike now has bora 50s which are fantastic.
Wheels can be stiff in different ways - radially and laterally etc. How these stiffness values come about in practice varies widly between brands depending on the spoke count, type, hub geometry, rim depth and rim stiffness. What you probably want, given your size, is more lateral stiffness so you get less brake rub. Often deeper wheels, as a system, are less laterally stiff becuase of an imbalance between the stiffness of the rim vs. the hub/spokes.

Shamals are pretty stiff wheels so I would suggest that it was derailleur setup rather than wheel flex that caused that problem. You either had an inwardly bent hanger or the low limit was too loose (I always confuse low n high haha). You were unlucky basically. Best thing is not to trust your bike to a shop mechanic (for many reasons).

Anyway, long story short, in general Camapganolo design very well balanced wheels that don't flex too much. I'd hazard to say you wont get too much brake up/flex with any WTO model. People here have suggested that the 45 feels the stiffest. That said, I think mid-depth wheels are totally redundant - you may as well cop the 50 gram weight penality and get a much more aero wheel.
Enigma Elite HSS|Sworks SL6|Colnago C60|De Rosa Protos|Bianchi Oltre XR4/2|BMC SLR01 16|Cdale Evo HM 12|Focus Izalco Max|RidleyHelium SL/SLX|BH Ultralight|Basso Diamante 15|Scapin Dyseys S8|Time ZXRS|TCR SL 12|Ridley Noah 08|Look 585|Cervelo SLC

Chuck
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:50 am

by Chuck

That's perfect, thank you. Yes lateral stiffness is more the concern. Good to know my assumption of deeper rim depth being stiffer was wrong, and after triple checking this derailleur I shouldn't be concerned with using the lowest gear.
Since you have a C60, the first bike was a C64 that arrived with a small crack in the bora one 50 wheel, which took 9 months to replace. In the meantime I got the shamals which had the unfortunate accident. They gave me a discount and I used the money to get the Specialissima elsewhere. Both beautiful, but still have a sour taste in my mouth.
And just for fun shallow vs deep. Aesthetically I like the shallow with this frame but the 50 or 60 would fit my build more.
Attachments
2B475A7F-61DE-4B36-81E7-ADB70671F94E.jpeg
AAE7FA57-3016-4E88-9AEB-66B33CF1FCC2.jpeg

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zappafile123
Posts: 496
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:24 am

by zappafile123

Chuck wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:58 am
That's perfect, thank you. Yes lateral stiffness is more the concern. Good to know my assumption of deeper rim depth being stiffer was wrong, and after triple checking this derailleur I shouldn't be concerned with using the lowest gear.
Since you have a C60, the first bike was a C64 that arrived with a small crack in the bora one 50 wheel, which took 9 months to replace. In the meantime I got the shamals which had the unfortunate accident. They gave me a discount and I used the money to get the Specialissima elsewhere. Both beautiful, but still have a sour taste in my mouth.
And just for fun shallow vs deep. Aesthetically I like the shallow with this frame but the 50 or 60 would fit my build more.
Eh sour taste is the worst. Life is short, wash your mouth out n get something new.

I didn't like the C60. Got rid of it pretty quickly. XR4 would have been better for you than the Specialissima.
Enigma Elite HSS|Sworks SL6|Colnago C60|De Rosa Protos|Bianchi Oltre XR4/2|BMC SLR01 16|Cdale Evo HM 12|Focus Izalco Max|RidleyHelium SL/SLX|BH Ultralight|Basso Diamante 15|Scapin Dyseys S8|Time ZXRS|TCR SL 12|Ridley Noah 08|Look 585|Cervelo SLC

Cycomanic
Posts: 196
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 11:10 pm

by Cycomanic

jlok wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:15 am
https://www.campagnolo.com/NL/en/Support/download

more hints here. try to refer to those technical manuals for bora one db.
The problem is that I just encountered the instructions for the Bora ultras with discs are different to what you have to do for WTOs (don't use the WHDB-0001 tool) and there is no info on campa's website for WTOs. So I'm a bit reluctant to try things if there are similar subleties as alluded to upthread. Maybe I just write to campa directly.

jlok
Posts: 1386
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Cycomanic wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:53 pm
jlok wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:15 am
https://www.campagnolo.com/NL/en/Support/download

more hints here. try to refer to those technical manuals for bora one db.
The problem is that I just encountered the instructions for the Bora ultras with discs are different to what you have to do for WTOs (don't use the WHDB-0001 tool) and there is no info on campa's website for WTOs. So I'm a bit reluctant to try things if there are similar subleties as alluded to upthread. Maybe I just write to campa directly.
As I wrote in previous 2 post, use a spanner to hold the preload lock ring (make sure the ring is tightended) and the axle will be fixed. Then you may use another spanner to loosen up the free hub lockring. I found this in a technical manual (Page 4 of this manual) and I used this technique to swap Shimano to XDR freehub on WTO 45 DB.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

nismosr
Posts: 1306
Joined: Mon May 05, 2008 5:15 pm

by nismosr

got my 60 the other day

Image#campagnolo WTO 60 by nismosr, on Flickr

Image#campagnolo WTO 60 by nismosr, on Flickr

Image#campagnolo WTO 60 by nismosr, on Flickr
Colnago C64 Mapei - Campagnolo SR11 EPS - Campagnolo Bora WTO 60 - P2Max
3T Strada Due - Sram Force AXS Etap
Basso Diamante - Campagnolo SR11 EPS - Lightweight Meilenstein - P2Max

Alexandrumarian
Posts: 647
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 6:34 pm
Location: Romania

by Alexandrumarian

Imagine this carbon finish on the tubes of a lugged frame.

Cycomanic
Posts: 196
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2020 11:10 pm

by Cycomanic

jlok wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:07 pm
Cycomanic wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:53 pm
jlok wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 3:15 am
https://www.campagnolo.com/NL/en/Support/download

more hints here. try to refer to those technical manuals for bora one db.
The problem is that I just encountered the instructions for the Bora ultras with discs are different to what you have to do for WTOs (don't use the WHDB-0001 tool) and there is no info on campa's website for WTOs. So I'm a bit reluctant to try things if there are similar subleties as alluded to upthread. Maybe I just write to campa directly.
As I wrote in previous 2 post, use a spanner to hold the preload lock ring (make sure the ring is tightended) and the axle will be fixed. Then you may use another spanner to loosen up the free hub lockring. I found this in a technical manual (Page 4 of this manual) and I used this technique to swap Shimano to XDR freehub on WTO 45 DB.
Sorry I misunderstood, yes I saw your post. It's interesting because the manual refers to Zonda wheels and look like a different axle diameter (the situations around DB axles is a mess), hence I was unsure. My reply should have probably been directed to the other message about hub disassembly.

jeanjacques
Posts: 305
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 11:01 am
Location: France

by jeanjacques

As I mesured my tire on the WTO 33, I cheched the rim width and at the widest point is 26,9mm :)
And the Grand Bois Cerf 26c extra light (187g) is 27,7mm.

by Weenie


sirRob
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:06 pm

by sirRob

I did the same with my new wto 33s and came to same result: rim width 26,8mm and Veloflex Corsa 28 is 27,4mm @ 85psi. So only a tiny overlap on each side of the rim. What a nice ride btw with the Veloflex tire + Latex tube on these wheels!

edit: after some miles they settled in now at 27,9mm.
Last edited by sirRob on Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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