ENVE 3.4 SES Warranty + Brake track vs Zipp

[spdntrxi]

I think the older Enve's might be more of an issue (so Ive heard).. the SES series not so much. i've done some good amount of descending with my 3.4's riding the brakes because of traffic on -12 slopes and then some... no issues. I do think Zipps brake marginally better however, but I prefer Enve's overall. Sorry haters.

link to that test would be nice... because the current link does not have Enve

[superdx]

Fairly recent but all the SES wheels are getting the new brake track treatment. http://www.bikerumor.com/2016/02/27/nah ... ther-news/

Wonder if this makes any difference. Was seriously considering 4.5 as my next set but this thread is giving me the jitters. Zipp 202s are perfect on all the descents but braking performance is not that good using Black Prince pads.

[tb123]

Wonder if this makes any difference. Was seriously considering 4.5 as my next set but this thread is giving me the jitters. Zipp 202s are perfect on all the descents but braking performance is not that good using Black Prince pads.

I've got a set of Black Prince pads in the cupboard waiting to go on my set of Zip202's, your post isn't filling me with confidence. For what it's worth, the original Zipp platinum pro evo pads are awesome on descents.

[Zigmeister]

I don't get this. Are we talking the clinchers specifically or tubulars? As you know, dimension date is purely on Enve wheels this year...probably all tubulars..but still, if these guys are putting the most abuse on a wheel, I don't know who would be.

With that said, how do we know they haven't had issues on the team wheels? They just go to the truck and pull 20 more wheels out and swap a bad one.

And nobody wants to talk about bad sponsor equipment.

The price and anecdotal stories makes you wonder.

I will say, when I had my 303 FCs, best carbon brake surface/stopping I've had on a wheel.

Also, I thought Enve is bragging/marketing now their improved braking surface...but you need to pop $3K+ on new wheels 2016 models.

[Zigmeister]

Fairly recent but all the SES wheels are getting the new brake track treatment. http://www.bikerumor.com/2016/02/27/nah ... ther-news/

Wonder if this makes any difference. Was seriously considering 4.5 as my next set but this thread is giving me the jitters. Zipp 202s are perfect on all the descents but braking performance is not that good using Black Prince pads.

Sorry, posted before I saw your post about the brake track improvements. Sure they are still very good now, but you need to pop the $3K+ and 2016 models to get this...and maybe all marketing hype? I dont know??

Would love some 4.5 SES clinchers as well...for now, using my custom built asian sets clincher/tubular with cxray/high-end hubs and swap them out for racing/training and spares during race.

[wingguy]

I don't get this. Are we talking the clinchers specifically or tubulars? As you know, dimension date is purely on Enve wheels this year...probably all tubulars..but still, if these guys are putting the most abuse on a wheel, I don't know who would be.

From what I have been told by Enve directly, last year when they started their DD sponsorship they asked the team how many wheels they normally used in a year then gave them half of that number - and the team never had to come back to them for more. Take that with a pinch of salt because they could have just lied to me, I don't know - but certainly in the MTB world it is legendary how few wheels the Santa Cruz Syndicate use per season compared to any other DH team.

Also, I thought Enve is bragging/marketing now their improved braking surface...but you need to pop $3K+ on new wheels 2016 models.

I don't quite understand what you're saying here. Of course you need to buy new wheels to get the new brake track. How could it be any other way? Or are you thinking that you need to buy the new wheelsets with the ultra-expensive Enve hub, because that's not the case.

[superdx]

Wonder if this makes any difference. Was seriously considering 4.5 as my next set but this thread is giving me the jitters. Zipp 202s are perfect on all the descents but braking performance is not that good using Black Prince pads.

I've got a set of Black Prince pads in the cupboard waiting to go on my set of Zip202's, your post isn't filling me with confidence. For what it's worth, the original Zipp platinum pro evo pads are awesome on descents.

I'm considering putting on the Zipp pads back on instead of the Black Prince. At the bottom of descents I literally have no more power and the bike just keeps going even though I'm squeezing the life out of my brakes.

I love how the 4.5s look. All this talk of delamination is scary stuff, not to mention annoying to have to go back to the shop for warranty (who knows how long that would take...)

[Denavelo]

All this delamination talk.... Do you guys ride your brakes down hills or something? The older Edge products prior to Enve had that issue. You can compare an Enve rim to an Edge rim and immediately see the difference in the brake track. These topics come up so much, and I just don't understand why you feel the need for Carbon rims if what you ride doesn't warrant it. Don't ride Carbon Clinchers if you ride nothing but steep hills with steep descending and you can't brake properly. I never ride the brakes, just a quick grab here and there to kill your momentum. Just like a Motorcyle. Trail braking, etc. Tapping the front here and there and slightly squeezing the rear. There's an art to all aspects of cycling, it's just not get on and ruin parts by grabbing nothing but brakes. If you feel the hills you ride are to dangerous to warrant carbon rims, don't buy them. There is nothing like a nice set of Alloy wheels with nice hubs and fat tires for that type of terrain.

Instead of threads about which rims have the best brake track, let's start threads on how to brake properly on a road bike, or sitting up on descents to kill your speeds. There are other way to get down a hill without holding a fist full of brake lever...

[wingguy]

Agreed. I don't think my shop has seen any repeat problems with any brake surface since some Easton EC90s from 2010. Haven't seen anything since then that wasn't good enough for even a barely competent rider. On the flip side some people's technique just makes you want to cry.

[Denavelo]

I've been on group rides and I cringe when I go on these rides. Just from all of the noise of people riding their brakes on downhills. I also attribute that to trying to scrub speed in a group on a descent.

I get that not all cyclists on the road come from some form of prior cycling discipline.

Braking technique is huge in road cycling and no one ever talks about it. They just heat up rims and blame manufactures for not producing a product that can withstand their lack of cycling skills.

I won't lie, there have been plenty of times where I'm on carbon hoops and had to ride my brakes. I cringed the entire time. Ya know, the next time I had that same route in my head, I rode on Alloy wheels.... Just saying. Unless you're riding a new road which is rare in our weekly/monthly monotonous routes that we ride, you'll know beforehand every corner you'll encounter that day. Same can be said for the hills you're going to ride. Choose your tool accordingly.

[Lugan]

Seems like disc brakes are tailor-made for people who don't know how to brake. It's one reason they are the future of road brakes. They will make heat build-up in composite structures an irrelevant issue.

[Belisarius]

Hi Guys, two part question.

1. I have just purchased a second hand bike with ENVE 3.4 SES wheels. They have done <500km and i have the original reciept from the previous owner. The wheels have NOT been registered online (so i can still do this with my own details).

Will i be able to send these wheels back to ENVE under warranty if they delaminate under braking? If i register them online under my own name surely that is enough of "proof" that i am the original owner? The receipt just has a cost on it, and the bike shop is in a different state.

2. My old wheels are 2015 V9 hub Zipp 303/404 combo. They definitely feel less stiff than the ENVE (spoke tension is less) however my main concern is delaminating the brake track.

i am an average descender, who brakes correctly. The steepest descents i do are 2-3km @ > 10%, up to 15%+. My zipps have remained perfect. I also do some longer 15km descents at 3-10% (but these require a lot less braking).

Should i be concerned? i am 78kg with a 6kg bike.

If the ENVE warranty will work, i will keep these wheels. If not, im afraid i might have to pass them on as i don't want to have a ruined brake track.

Thanks!

SAME HERE ON BRAND NEW ENVE SES 4.5 tubulars, the breaking surface appears to delaminate on FLAT RIDING and deceleration!!!! 1,300 kms I noticed it early on, took me a while (nearly missing a turn) to contact them...