Colnago C64 - Inside and Out

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Calnago
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by Calnago

@mag... Yes, the stuff I had was some kind of tubing like you show in your chart, for laboratory "plumbing apparatus'" and the like. It was 1.5mm x 3.2mm. I just ordered some stuff from Jaguar that they use as liner for their metal links and it's 1.8 x 2.7mm. But the stuff in your chart that's 1.5 x 2.5 looks like it would be perfect for my needs. Slightly smaller diameter than the Jaguar liners, perfect for a derailleur cable with an i.d. of 1.5mm whereas the derailleur cable is 1.25 or something. And decent wall thickness. Tubing like this is just one of the "supplies" we need these days I guess. Only thing is they sell it in minimum quantities like 10 meters so you’re looking at about $60 or so. That’s why if you can find a place that will just give you some scraps like I stumbled upon it’s a good find.
Do you have one of these frames on order?
Last edited by Calnago on Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:11 am, edited 2 times in total.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Ok, one final demo by exaggeration on the new headset, by Acros. The change in the new headset is essentially in going from an alloy top cup to a composite material of polymers and nylon and elastomers, which simply absorbs impact better than alloy would. For the C60, they used a nylon (or something like that) compression ring as shown below...
Image
The ring on the left was an early version, then they switched to the beveled version on the right. The beveled version is what's on the C64. The idea was/is to provide a bit of a buffer between the steertube and the actual bearing. Ok, that's nice. With the headset in the C64, they've one upped themselves by also creating the cups of a composite material as well, or at least the flanges (I didn't remove them).
Image

And here's a cheesy iPhone video I made just for a funny change of pace which demonstrates the principle behind the new headset... Try not to laugh too hard...

If you've ever worked on a concrete floor for any length of time, you can probably appreciate one of those hard rubber mats underfoot. Same idea. Will you notice on your bike... uh... sure.. uh maybe... uh... how's the pressure in your tires doing?
Last edited by Calnago on Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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Calnago
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by Calnago

oops... double post.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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jimaizumi
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by jimaizumi

Calnago wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:34 am
Ha! Was that you? About the cable ports and threatening to stuff it full of Sugru, and the swimming pool too? And the chain dropping... you as well? Lol. Geez, there’s always one guy on every trip that causes 90% of the problems. :)
As for the slot at the bottom bracket of the C60, and C59 for that matter... it’s a slot that is only exposed to the rear, meaning that for stuff to get in there it has to come from behind, which is pretty hard when you are going forward. Never been a problem for me. And pretty clean in there whenever I’ve removed the crankset. But I sure do like the new bottom bracket as far as the new cable routing goes. They claim that the larger radius going around the large BB shell like that makes for better shifting. Which I totally agree with, but not as much of an improvement as if they had routed the derailleur cables at the headtube like I route mine. I don't know why some manufacturers still route them that way when the alternative way like I've shown is so viable.
Don't you love these "no, that wasn't me, nah, that wasn't me either but the last part was me" type of replies.. No clue on the chain dropping issues but the "Get all Macgyver with the Suguru" definitely had my name written all over it. Glad we easily tossed that aside!

Regarding the slot, its not what can get in from having been ridden but more or less what can get in otherwise, like say if you were to leave your bike next to a puddle or even on a patch of dry dirt where anything kicked up by what goes around the bike can easily get in. I still remember my spindle having light traces of fine sand on it when I pulled it out for a quick maintenance job. I guess its not such a big deal in the larger gist of things but the new C64 certainly solves all that.
:oops: THE PAST: 2005 Cannondale R700, 2006 Specialized S-Works Tarmac Gerolsteiner, 2009 Pinarello Dogma FPX My Way, 2011 Time RXR VIP

:D THE PRESENT: 2016 Colnago C60 ST01, 2017 Wilier Cento 10 Ramato

:wink: THE FUTURE: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

mag
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by mag

Calnago wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:11 am
... Do you have one of these frames on order?
Yes, I ordered C60 some time ago, but before they got to it C64 was introduced and they just stopped producing C60s. So I decided to change my order to C64 and now will see how long it's going to take. :D

r4nd0mv4r14bl3
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by r4nd0mv4r14bl3

Calnago wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:19 pm

Front...
Image
Perhaps this is discussed already somewhere but ... a question about DM brakes and this fork design.

Do these recesses in the fork allow enough room for brake shoes to open if you want to remove a wide tire mounted wheel?

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Calnago
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by Calnago

mag wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:30 pm
Calnago wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 2:11 am
... Do you have one of these frames on order?
Yes, I ordered C60 some time ago, but before they got to it C64 was introduced and they just stopped producing C60s. So I decided to change my order to C64 and now will see how long it's going to take. :D
Having spent the intimate time I have with this beauty now, I think you made the right call. Not gonna lie... I'm more than a bit jealous.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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Calnago
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by Calnago

r4nd0mv4r14bl3 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:19 pm
Calnago wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:19 pm

Front...
Image
Perhaps this is discussed already somewhere but ... a question about DM brakes and this fork design.

Do these recesses in the fork allow enough room for brake shoes to open if you want to remove a wide tire mounted wheel?
That, I do not know. I myself haven't spent enough time with the various configurations of DM brakes and various wheel widths to know for sure. But I have worked on a DM brake bike where those recesses would have been welcome. The thing is, you're still limited to a tire size of 28mm (that's a real size, not nominal width). You may be able to get away with a bit bigger but not much. So, in that case, just how wide a rim would you ever expect to be using? The 24.2mm width of my Boras is perfect for the 27mm Vlanderens that I have mounted. Colnago really isn't in the mountain bike business these days and I, for one, am quite happy about that.
Last edited by Calnago on Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Lightweenie wrote:
Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:30 pm
I thought the headtube shape was like that to facilitate integrated disc-brake routing (in combination with the new stem)...
I missed this question way back on page one of this thread. The integrated disc-brake routing through the headtube will be facilitated with the new fork and steertube, which does have a pretty cool new design. I showed a rendering of it earlier in the thread. It has a channel that the hydraulic housing can run down towards the front brake. It also has some reinforcements which alleviate the need for the huge compression plug of around 40grams, as well as a built in "starnut" to provide the anchor to provide the preload from the top cap. But none of that was apparent in the fork on this bike, it was same ol, same ol, as far as those things were concerned. While the channel for the hydraulic line is very disc specific, I see no reason why that very cool new steertube couldn't be used in the rim brake version as well. That would be a nice bonus.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

stax
Posts: 77
Joined: Fri May 18, 2012 3:35 am

by stax

Thanks for this thread Cal- thoroughly enjoying it.

Which colour are you going to get? There is surely no point in denying the inevitable... :beerchug:

My money is on BFWH!

kgibbo1868
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by kgibbo1868

Image
This!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Pain is my friend!

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Calnago
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by Calnago

stax wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:25 am
Thanks for this thread Cal- thoroughly enjoying it.
Which colour are you going to get? There is surely no point in denying the inevitable... :beerchug:
My money is on BFWH!
Ha... maybe I should start a two part poll:
A) Will Cal succumb to his carnal desires and end up with this mistress after all; and
B) If he does... what dress is he gonna put her in. I know I mentioned PR99 (again) would be a the top of my wish list earlier, but I think now I'd go for something different... hmmm..

Geez... let me at least finish this thread first. Almost done, but every time I've said that in the last couple of days, something else pops into my head that I want to talk about. So I'm taking my time.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

Devastazione
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:06 pm
Location: Sardinia, Italy.

by Devastazione

Hi Calnago,good evening from Italy.

I’m about to have my c64 PKRD shipped and i’m still undecided about cable routing ( going mechanical of course) . The thing i’m mostly paranoid about is to cross or not cross the cables inside the down tube ( California cross ). Now,most if not ALL of the Colnago builds i see here are not built with the cable crossing and honestly speaking they sort of look ugly. But in the c64 we all know where entry ports are so maybe that is more of a necessity than a looking good thing.
To make a long story short : my tarmac WITHOUT the cable crossing had a miserable shifting,I had to disassemble the whole thing and cross the cable to fix the problem. Do you thing we will have huge loop of cables if we’ll cross them like you did on your C60 ? But most importantly: any risk of bad shifting if we won’t ? Colnago’s chief engineer Davide Fumagalli is very active on our Italian forum and he said no issues whatsoever,but he’s referring to Campy groups of course,i’m building my bike with DA 9100.
Anyway,looking forward to see your excellent job take shape,keep up the good job :thumbup:

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Calnago
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by Calnago

@Devastazione... Some posts back, maybe pages now, I went into details about the cable routing. I even put on a stem and bars with shifters mounted (Shimano) to see how the line from the handelbars down to the port in the downtube would look and function. Go back in the thread and you will find it. Have no concerns, the look and function will be better than the the "traditional method" that they have done on every review bike I have seen. Plus, there will be no point on the frame where the cable housing even touches it. My C60 looks good, and I was concerned as to whether I could get a loop as nice as that with the new port located where it is in the downtube on the C64. But no worries... I'm now confident the lines of the cable routing will look even better than on my C60. So, regardless of whether you're using Campagnolo or Shimano mechanical... you will be just fine and I completely recommend routing the shifting cables such that they cross in the downtube. It is just simply better. Just make sure they don't get twisted around each other inside the downtube. I just went back and grabbed the link to the actual post where I show the mocked up cable routing as I describe above. Sometimes these links (in tapatalk) just take you to the start of the thread, but when viewing via a regular browser it seems to work, and takes you directly to the relevant post... viewtopic.php?f=10&t=150143&start=150#p1381242

By the way, I think some people might be thinking I am actually building this frame up for myself. That is not the case. For one, it's way too small for me being only a 52 sloping. Secondly, it's not mine. I really had no intention of creating a thread like this when I saw the frame for the first time a week ago Saturday. Just thought I'd take a few pics since it was just released and post them up for people to see. Then the idea just popped into my head about creating a thread about things I think about before I even start building a bike from the frame up... much like you are doing right now in trying to imagine the cable routing scenario. It's kind of turned into a tell all I know about Colnago frames, inside and out, kind of affair. And an affair is exactly what it's turning into. Unlike when the C60 first came out, I have fallen in love with this frame in only a week. It took me much longer to warm up to the changes in the C60 over the C59, mostly because of the massive downtube, but then I grew to love it even more than the C59 for all it offered as improvements, some minor and some major. But like I said in an earlier post, no one should feel like their current Colnagos are all of a sudden chopped liver. Unlike any other manufacturer I can think of, no brand's bicycles, on balance, have such an eduring appeal to them, both for their aesthetic appeal as well as their robust build quality.
Last edited by Calnago on Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

Devastazione
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:06 pm
Location: Sardinia, Italy.

by Devastazione

Got it ! We do agree on most stuff : I hate seeing those little protective films on a frame. Well,i’m gonna have to experiment with my mechanic as soon as I get the frame,but most likely it’ll be cable crossing.
Last edited by Devastazione on Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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