Cervelo R3 Disc 2018

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siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

Long time no update. Was travelling (including two weeks of riding in Spain on my trusty old Roubaix!) and funds are running low too (buying house in order to have proper mancave :D ). Anyway, did the first cut on the fork steerer yesterday and that shaved off about 28 grams. Probably will cut couple of more cm once the fit is dialled. But it won't be slammed anyway.

Today I placed order on Hunt Aero Light (aluminium) wheelset. I'm running a bit behind the schedule - bike needs to be ready before end of June and I need to make compromises. In case noone will buy my old bike I will probably need to hack something together with existing groupset (can choose between Ultegra 6800 and Force22) and some TRP hy/rd type brake calipers. I'm also little bit cautious of going for full Etap HRD 11-speed group because it seems 12 speed and/or 1x etap is about to be announced quite soon and this would even make me think of going 1x because I don't need close ratio gaps (probably because of my mountain biking background).

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

@Fluffman, I don't think I will ever put fenders on this bike. I have a city/touring/winter hack bike for wet conditions riding.

by Weenie


siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

I attempted to install BB and crankset today. Strange things happened. First of all, it all seemed smooth: cleaned everything up, applied anti-seize as recommended by C-Bear and pressed the BB into frame. Felt really nice and tight. However, when I tried to install crankset (Rotor 3D+ taken off from another Cervelo), it was destined to fail because BB was too wide and there was no way that drive side nut would reach the threads in the spindle.

Then I took some measurements:
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As you can see, the BB part that hangs outside the BB shell makes whole BB 91mm wide. BB is pressed until the end - the part outside the frame has 49mm diameter which is 3mm more than the BB shell AFAIK.

I've reached out to C-Bear, but wanted to get it out here as well. My question is: is there any way I can still use that BB and crank? Has C-Bear shipped me incorrect BB?

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

C-Bear support was really quick to respond and here's whay I found out:
1) Rotor 3D+ cranksets produced for Cervelo OEM fitment have shorter spindle than "normal" 3D+ cranksets
2) the BB C-Bear sells as "for BBRight and Rotor 3D+ compatible" is actually only suitable for the aftermarket Rotor cranksets with longer spindle.
3) In order to use the crank with C-Bear BB, i need to remove current drive side bb cup and instead install same cup as is used on the non drive side.

I will keep talking to C-Bear to find out if they can send me another non drive side BB cup.

1415chris
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:59 am
Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

Im not so sure if that is the case.
I'm on Rotor cranks for number of years.
Currently using 3D+, but also have 3D which came with the bike (S5 2016). When I took it of it was still with the same DS spacer as the other Rotor cranks I have and used to have.
What NDS cup are you referring to?

mrlobber
Posts: 767
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:36 am
Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

With the BB pressed in, the BBright shell width should be 79, well, maybe 80mm. I'm not sure where the additional DS 10mm on your first pic come from.

The 3D+ crank should install on BBright with no additional spacers on the NDS side (well, maybe some 0.5mm shims to account for frame<->crank tolerances).
If OEM Cervelo 3D+ cranks had shorter spindle (I think that was the case some 4-5 years ago, and not now anymore), the axle shorteness could only be compensated on the DS by removing the 5mm spacer or replacing it with a smaller width one.

... which suggests that either you've messed up something with the BB press in (unlikely?) or C-Bear have sent you a wrong one (happened to me once from them, btw).
Retired bikes: Cervelo S5 2015 / Felt AR FRD 2014 / Cannondale SS HM 2014 / Scott Addict SL 2014 / Scott Plasma Premium 2014 / Orbea Orca 2008 / Look 596 /

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

Thanks for thinking with me.
1415chris wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 7:43 am
What NDS cup are you referring to?
Maybe I used wrong term but I was talking about the BB itself. The thing that C-Bear is producing and that I pressed to the BB shell of the frame. This thing on the scale that says "left" on it:
Image
mrlobber wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 8:28 am
With the BB pressed in, the BBright shell width should be 79, well, maybe 80mm. I'm not sure where the additional DS 10mm on your first pic come from.
You are right and the BB shell is 79mm. But additional 10 mm comes from the drive side BB cup hanging over the edge. You can see also from the C-Bear product image that there is a larger diameter section on the drive side cup:
Image
mrlobber wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 8:28 am
The 3D+ crank should install on BBright with no additional spacers on the NDS side (well, maybe some 0.5mm shims to account for frame<->crank tolerances).
If OEM Cervelo 3D+ cranks had shorter spindle (I think that was the case some 4-5 years ago, and not now anymore), the axle shorteness could only be compensated on the DS by removing the 5mm spacer or replacing it with a smaller width one.

... which suggests that either you've messed up something with the BB press in (unlikely?) or C-Bear have sent you a wrong one (happened to me once from them, btw).
I didn't add any spacers at all.

mrlobber
Posts: 767
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:36 am
Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

OK, I get it, this is C-Bear's special BB, intended for 3D+ installation in BBRight frames without any spacers at all. If so, then the 91mm width of the C-Bear BB seems to be too large, it should be ~87mm.
Retired bikes: Cervelo S5 2015 / Felt AR FRD 2014 / Cannondale SS HM 2014 / Scott Addict SL 2014 / Scott Plasma Premium 2014 / Orbea Orca 2008 / Look 596 /

commendatore
Posts: 194
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:51 am

by commendatore

From Kogel:

“For Rotor crank sets, please note that Rotor makes custom crank sets for Cervelo that are specific to BBRight. This bottom bracket is only for after market Rotor crank sets.”

https://www.kogel.cc/collections/bbrigh ... 0mm-cranks

1415chris
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:59 am
Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

Bbright shell is 79mm, Rotor's DS spacer is 11.5, so you get 90.5mm overall.
Still enough space left for NDS preload nut.
This C-bear bb is absolutely right for BB-right, but not for your crank.
It looks like it must be an old unit.
These days Rotor cranks supplied with Cervelo bikes are standard, aftermarket ones.

TheInnertube
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:38 pm

by TheInnertube

Have you guys also noticed that you will have sometimes some brake rub? and that it starts to squil when breaking hard. I noticed that the squiling stopped when i did put the power down again?
when yes how do you guys deal with it

nesfyl
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 8:06 am

by nesfyl

TheInnertube wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 11:14 am
Have you guys also noticed that you will have sometimes some brake rub? and that it starts to squil when breaking hard. I noticed that the squiling stopped when i did put the power down again?
when yes how do you guys deal with it
My front caliper rubs on the rotor for a few seconds after braking hard, usually going downhill at a high speed, before a corner. It's an issue of thermal expansion of the braking fluid and the rotor itself most probably, because the issue disappears when it cools off a little. I tried centering the caliper etc. but I cannot eliminate it completely. It happens infrequently though, and therefore I'm not too bothered about it, but yes, I experience it too.

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

My build is slowly progressing. BB woes were resolved thanks to fantastic support from C-Bear. They sent me new BB no questions asked and this new one fits frame and cranks as expected. In short: the spindle of Cervelo OEM version of Rotor cranks was indeed shorter than aftermarket Rotor cranks and it needed different BB. I also had some trouble installing the crank so that it would spin freely. More details in this thread: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/foru ... 3&t=151938

Now it's all good though and I can continue building it up. Wheels have arrived from Hunt. They are Aero Light model.
Front:
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Rear:
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I bought used Specialized hover handlebar. Wanted to try it out because I know I can't live with very low position. Let's see how this works out.
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Some pictures of current state:

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Rest of the build is going to look like this:
- Ultegra 6800 shifters and derailleurs (coming off my wife's bike, she's moving to di2)
- TRP Spyre brake calipers (ordered)
- Fabric saddle (taking off from current bike)
- Fabric bar tape (ordered)
- Look pedals
- Some cassette and chain I have lying around. Goingo to install the 11-32 first because I'm going to Dolomites in few weeks.

Everything did not go according to the original plan but I will have plenty of time to upgrade in the future. Now I just want to and ride it already!

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

This week I was busy getting last parts of the puzzle and building it all up. I have to say it's my first time doing full build from ground up all by myself and there was a lot to learn for me, especially things like setting up BB, wrapping the handlebar tape etc. Yesterday I finally managed to have it in a rideable state:

Image

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The worst news is that one of the bottle cage mounts on the downtube is broken. It's loose from the frame and I can't even remove the Fabric bolt anymore. Will take the frame to LBS on Monday, but it's really bad timing because I need to go to Maratona (sportive in Dolomites) in couple of weeks.

Current build list:
Image

Also as text for the search engine:
Component Brand Model Size Weight
Frame Cervelo R3 Disc 56 cm 897.4
Through axle Cervelo RAT 67.5
Seat Collar Cervelo R3 15.7
Chain catcher Cervelo 11.2
Bottle cage bolts Cervelo 5.1
Fork Cervelo R3 Disc 353
Through axle Cervelo RAT 60.2
TA hardware Cervelo 6
Bottom Bracket C-Bear bb-bbr-86-r mixed 101
Crankset Rotor 3D+ 172.5, 110BCD 494
Chainrings BOR 34/50 132.3
Chainring bolts Rotor 9
Front Derailleur Shimano Ultegra 6800 87.1
Rear Derailleur Shimano Ultegra 6800 GS 209.6
Cables and housing 207 (calculated)
Chain Sram PC-113 243.7
Cassette Sram PG-1070 11-32 306.5
Brifters Shimano Ultegra 6800 421.6
Brake calipers TRP Spyre 307.5
Rear brake hw Noname Bolts M5x35 15.1
Front brake hw TRP FM1.1 22.9
Headset FSA 61.7
Expander Schmolke Expander SL 15.5
Stem Kalloy Uno 100mm 109
Spacers BBB Carbon 6.3
Handlebar Specialized Hover alloy 42cm 274.6
Bar tape Fabric Silicone 136
Seatpost Cervelo SP19 209.8
Saddle Fabric Scoop Shallow 264.2
Pedals Look Keo Classic 272.1
Front Wheel Hunt Aero Light Disc taped 714.2
Rear wheel Hunt Aero Light Disc taped 831
CL to 6-bolt Hunt 85.2
Front rotor Sram Centerline 160mm 115
Rear rotor Sram Centerline 140mm 94.2
Front tire Schwalbe Pro One 25c 261
Rear tire Schwalbe Pro One 25c 260.4
Sealant Stan's and Muc-Off 74
Valves Hunt 7.8
Bottle cages Fabric 5
Garmin mount Sram 20
Total: 7790.4


Let's just say there's room for improvement in terms of weight :) regardless, I'm mostly happy with the result. First ride was late evening yesterday, didn't get really good idea how the bike feels but I did understand that it's a lot different from my old Roubaix SL4.
Couple of issues/niggles:
* BOR rings shift like crap - especially from small to big is very noisy and slow. Maybe needs some more adjustments but seems like first upgrade is going to be some Praxis rings or even whole new crankset...
* ...because there's also issue with chainline: due to wider spacing in the rear, front chainrings are 2.5mm inboard from where they should be. This means on small chainring 11t and 12t in the rear are not really useable. Any suggestions how to fix this issue? Are there "disc specific" cranksets or chainrings with wider chainline?[/list]

siim
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:37 pm
Location: Estonia

by siim

This thread needs an update :)
In my last post I complained that the bottle cage mount came loose. A local shop was able to help and using a pin tool they fixed the mount and so far so good.

On a related note, I needed to change the bottles and cages because Fabrics were too close to the frame and started to rattle when riding on less than perfect tarmac. Right now took something from the parts bin but will need to get something nice. Tune Wasserträger 2.0 is pleasing to my eye and the weight and price are reasonable as well.

I owe some scale shots too, here they are.
Sram Centerline 160mm rotor. With rounded edges.
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Sram centerline 140mm rotor. Again with rounded edges.
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Rotor mounting bolts. Sram.
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TRP Spyre SLC caliper
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Front brake mounting hardware from TRP
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Mounting hardware for rear brake (flat mount, from local hardware store)
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Sram 1170 cassette, 11-32 for the mountains and untrained legs!
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Sram 1130 chain. Not sure how many links but it's not full length.
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Fabric Silicone handlebar tape. Uncut, one side.
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Look Keo Classic pedals
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BBB spacer, carbon, 20mm IIRC
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Fabric Scoop Shallow Race saddle
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Hunt Centerlock to 6-bolt adapter
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That's all for now. I have to see if I took any more scale shots but rest of the items should be standard Shimano Ultegra stuff anyway.

by Weenie


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