Re: MTB Tubular

Discuss light weight issues concerning mountain bikes & parts.

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robbosmans
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by robbosmans

Tubeless is so dialed for mtb’s, Tubeless is everything tubs used to be but way better.

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xsport
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by xsport

I still ride every kind of tire/solution on my bikes (road, gravel, mtb) and I think that if the Tufo adhesive tape and the liquid latex were discovered some 20 years before, tubulars tires should still be very popular today among cyclists. Personally they're my first choice for road and mtb, and for gravel they're even more important. Speaking about XC mtb the situation is becoming absurd in my opinion because mtbikers are riding bigger and biggers rims and tires and using inserts when a simple tubeless tubular tire with less than 50 grams of latex should give you better performance and reliability.
Perhaps, if gravel races will become more populars, we'll see a new evolution for off road tubulars.
I hope so because the only problem that I see is the lack of models apart from road tubulars.
Let's see... Challenge started the game.

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LeDuke
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by LeDuke

The problem was and always has been tires.

The Challenge tires were paper thin at both the casing and tread. I tore one open on a trail I’d ridden hundreds of times.

The Tufo offerings were marginally better. Narrow, poor compound and bad tread design, but at least you didn’t puncture on them every ride.

I sold off one of my two pairs of tubular wheels. I still have a set of XRC 950 T wheels gathering dust in my garage.


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robbosmans
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by robbosmans

xsport wrote:Speaking about XC mtb the situation is becoming absurd in my opinion because mtbikers are riding bigger and biggers rims and tires and using inserts when a simple tubeless tubular tire with less than 50 grams of latex should give you better performance and reliability.
No, a Tubeless MTB tire will give way better performance and reliability. They are also way easier to install. Inserts are great they offer great protection not only for punctures but also for you rims. They allow to run even lower pressures, something that isn’t possible on tubs.

Tubulars also only made sense in XC, that’s only a small part of mountainbiking.

Saying Tubulars are better today is not true and stupid. You can still like them because you like old stuff, but Tubeless is just the natural evolution of tires, its better in every single way

ghostinthemachine
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by ghostinthemachine

The last and miniscule advantages of MTB tubulars are that you can ride them flat with a higher level of confidence than tubeless and they don't burp.
And even those advantages are disappearing, with the latest tubeless rims, inserts, better fitting tire beads and so on.
Once you factor in the shorter courses and pit support. It's really a no brainer to use tubeless.

Added to that you can streamline the number of wheels you need to take and select/swap tires during pre ride and even on the day of the event.

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hjb1000
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by hjb1000

xsport wrote:
Mon Sep 06, 2021 9:54 pm
I think that if the Tufo adhesive tape and the liquid latex were discovered some 20 years before, tubulars tires should still be very popular today among cyclists. Personally they're my first choice for road and mtb, and for gravel they're even more important.
I agree that Tufos are great and highly underated for mtb. I'm going to continue using them, although I agree it would be nice if Tufo introduced some updated treads and sizes. Tubular for life.
I see that Challenge now offer a range of Gravel tubless tubular tires which look really promising. Did I read that these tubeless tubulars are made by Tufo I think...

xsport
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by xsport

No they're different:
-Tufo are made with some fabric covered by vulcanized rubber both outside and inside
-Challenge tubeless tubulars are hand made tubulars, so made with more fabric and no rubber, and inside there's a something like a latex inner tube glued to the fabric
I know very well both of them and they're both very reliable (much more than the Duguast tire with ORI solution that doesn't work at all). Challenge are even better than Tufo and they're so reliable that they seem puncture and cutting proof. Believe me because I made different test even with tools on an old tire that I had to throw away... They're only for gravel bikes and a 36mm tire, on the road, proved to be as fast as 25mm avarage road racing clinchers. The only down is the weight because they're about 500 grams and this's part of the reasons of their reliability...

xsport
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by xsport

robbosmans wrote:
Tue Sep 07, 2021 8:44 am
xsport wrote:Speaking about XC mtb the situation is becoming absurd in my opinion because mtbikers are riding bigger and biggers rims and tires and using inserts when a simple tubeless tubular tire with less than 50 grams of latex should give you better performance and reliability.
No, a Tubeless MTB tire will give way better performance and reliability. They are also way easier to install. Inserts are great they offer great protection not only for punctures but also for you rims. They allow to run even lower pressures, something that isn’t possible on tubs.

Tubulars also only made sense in XC, that’s only a small part of mountainbiking.

Saying Tubulars are better today is not true and stupid. You can still like them because you like old stuff, but Tubeless is just the natural evolution of tires, its better in every single way
I don't know if you ride both tubulars and tubeless tires, I do it. At the same pressure, let's say 1,5 bar, a tubeless tire is much stiffer than a tubular tire so stating that you can inflate tubeless tires at a lower pressure means nothing. The disadvantage of a tubeless with an insert inside is that it has less deformation capacity on stones that means less grip. And if you go too low with the pressure the problems come from the fact that on stones you can loose air from the sides.
Inserts are a very good idea for tubeless tires so much that I could say they're "necessary". They could even be on option for tubular tires. But you need them for very special reasons. So special that at the moment I can't even make an example because in my full mtb career (in the Alps on rocky trails) I never had problems that hasn't been solved by the Latex without stopping (90% of the situations) or a simple tire plug ( 8%: less than 1 minute without pumping the tire; 2% about 2 minutes with tire repair air pressure foam).

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