Liggero wrote:[
To each their own. But some people here seem to be biased, or lacking knowledge or out of topic.
No. Some people just have a different opinion to yours. It would seem from your history that this presents a problem.
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Liggero wrote:Back to topic: I don't have lot of expertise in the 3 brands, but I´m not so biased as I don't care which one is better. There are only 3, and each has its good and bad points. I think there is not, "the best", at least not today, not as a full groupset. Sram has the best front shifting now. Very recently they were the worst. Shimano has the best electronic group by far. Campy is lighter than shimano, the best looking perhaps, although too classic. Sram offers BB30, although there are 3rd party cranks which are better than these three, just like it happens with wheels and brakes.
To each their own. But some people here seem to be biased, or lacking knowledge or out of topic.
ultimobici wrote:Liggero wrote:Back to topic: I don't have lot of expertise in the 3 brands, but I´m not so biased as I don't care which one is better. There are only 3, and each has its good and bad points. I think there is not, "the best", at least not today, not as a full groupset. Sram has the best front shifting now. Very recently they were the worst. Shimano has the best electronic group by far. Campy is lighter than shimano, the best looking perhaps, although too classic. Sram offers BB30, although there are 3rd party cranks which are better than these three, just like it happens with wheels and brakes.
To each their own. But some people here seem to be biased, or lacking knowledge or out of topic.
Biased or lacking knowledge? Not really, I deal with Campagnolo, Shimano & Sram on a daily basis. I see their warranty rates firsthand, again day in day out. I have owned all three manufacturers' kit in the last 5 years and regularly ride the latest products as part of my job.
All three produce good stuff, but opinions on whose shifts better are purely subjective. It depends on who set up the bike in the first place too. I've worked with mechanics who can set up Campag & Shimano with their eyes shut, yet they find Sram awkward. Conversely, I know people who find things the other way round.
Sram are by necessity followers in many respects. They had to wait for Shimano to go to 11 speed so they could marry their 11 speed set up to Shimano.
From a warranty point of view, Sram & Shimano trail Campagnolo in my experience. Equally when it comes to serviceability, Campagnolo is streets ahead in its price and ease of repair. If you compare the cost of repairing a Shimano STI with that of an Ergopower it's evident that Shimano aren't in the business of serviceable componentry. Sram aren't as bad, but it is hard to find the correct parts in the UK as the distributor's website is steam powered! Campagnolo is easy in comparison. Part numbers are simple to find, and parts are readily accessible, even for models several years old.
EPS doesn't sell? News to me sunshine! What do you base your assumption on? Have you used EPS? Hell have you even seen it in the flesh?Liggero wrote:It depends on each rider of course. But I´ve never ever broke a shimano part or sram, specially not during the warranty period, so that data in my case doesn't matter, same with reparability. Sram shifters are definitely weaker in this sense, but for a normal user, it makes no difference. weight and price makes a diference from first moment, same as front trimming. EPS is just worse from day one, also in price. And that is why it doesn't sell. Campy is definitely exclusive in price. And getting a campy wheel is more complicated that getting a shimano wheel. Also in races. Same thing happens with pedals in amateur races, talking bout second bike or car bikes.
Campagnolo made their own cassette body in 1997 for 9 speed and have stuck with it ever since. For this reason my Record Ti hubs are still in use despite me now running 11 speed. When I get round to sending the rear wheel off to Campagnolo's service centre they'll have brand new bearing races fitted so they are as smooth as they were 16 years ago. I used to use a pair of Dura Ace 7403 hubs with 10 speed Sram but the 11-up cassette necessitated a washer behind it which made for a tight fit between the frame & top gear. No issue with any of my Campag hubbed wheels. Funny eh?Being a follower is the only way to use the same standards, and no new ones. Shimano can create a new standard for BB tomorrow if they want, sram just can't. Campy could, and it would be their death. No frame manufacturer would follow. Again, not the bees knees, they are ducati, for the good and for the bad.
Geoff wrote:Switching between the two systems is a bit of a pain...
stella-azzurra wrote:All 3 manufacturers make good brakes
ultimobici wrote:4-5 times, where do you get that figure? 2 or 3 to 1 I'll give you based on what I invoice. As for service wheels, a 10 speed system will work ok either way round. Again this is based on experience. As for 11 speed I haven't tried to use a Shimano wheel in my Campagnolo set-up, so can't say for sure how it behaves.
It's not that I don't want to see, rather I see a shed-load more to base my opinion on. Sales, warranty & spares availability all go to support Campagnolo being not only desired but a practical & cost efficient option. Veloce is far better a choice than 105, being cheaper, lighter & more durable. Athena carbon with Chorus levers makes for a similar situation compared to Ultegra.