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 Post subject: Stumped - Sticky SRAM
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:05 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:55 am
Posts: 369
SRAM Red 2013.

Perfect downshift - Crisp

Upshift - gets tighter and more difficult the further up the cassette I go. I can shift through all gears but it is significantly more tight that my other 2013 red gruppo.

Replaced all cable and housing, length good as well ... when un tightened at the pinch bolt the shifter shifts freely and happily. No stress. Cable guide under the bottom bracket is clean and oiled.

This leaves me to believe that maybe ... this is a rear derailleur issue over shifter pod.

Anyway - im all ears and im stumped .... thoughts?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:48 pm 
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When you push the derailleur by hand across its range of motion does the resistance increase?

If it does, your issue is a function of the rear derailleur spring getting tighter as it is extended (and is probably normal, though you could check by comparing to another example- at a shop or on a friend's bike, if you don't have another bike with Sram Red).


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Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:48 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:54 pm 
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Location: it's raining, it must be uk
it'll be a hassle, but if you can't find the cause, swap the rd with the one on the bike that's ok and see if the issue moves with the rd or not


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:03 pm 
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Are you sure your B-screw is adjusted properly?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:46 pm 
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try lubing your cables with the shimano cable lube. I had the same problem as you when i switched away from gore ride-on.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:44 pm 
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Location: Los Angeles
RD cable tensioned too tightly to start with?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:08 pm 
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Location: Netherlands
Be sure the cable is routed correctly inside the shifter. It's possible to install the cable so the wire does not go into the small hole in the spool but under the spool outside the guide, will exit the shifter in the right place so you don't notice it. If this happens the shifter "works" as the head catches and pulls "correctly" but as the wire is not guided along the spool the friction is very high.

We see a few DIY cable installs come into the shop this way. Typically the person said they fought to install but then suddenly went in easy.

Of course the obvious-RD movement by hand, no odd bends, if internal downtube routing cables no wrapped around each other.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:36 pm 
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I'm with sigismond0, the B screw seems a likely culprit.

I'd also check what Cosmo said - getting the cable started off in the shifter can be a pain in the butt, especially if you aren't using SRAM cables which are ever so slightly thinner than others.

Last, is your chain really short?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:22 am 
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Location: NoVA/DC
Does the frame have internal cable routing? Cables crossed inside the down tube?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 10:36 am 
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Cosmo wrote:
Be sure the cable is routed correctly inside the shifter. It's possible to install the cable so the wire does not go into the small hole in the spool but under the spool outside the guide, will exit the shifter in the right place so you don't notice it. If this happens the shifter "works" as the head catches and pulls "correctly" but as the wire is not guided along the spool the friction is very high.

We see a few DIY cable installs come into the shop this way. Typically the person said they fought to install but then suddenly went in easy.

Cosmo - I just removed the original cables in my SRAM Force shifters and replaced them with Yokozuna cables. I've found that the cable head sometimes comes loose from the spool. I have given the cable a good firm pull (as per the instructions) to ensure the head is seated correctly in the spool. But if I run up and down the ratchet, sometimes the cable head comes loose.

Note I haven't tightened the cable to the rear derailleur yet, it's still hanging free once it leaves the housing.

Will this still be a problem once the cable has more tension when it is attached to the derailleur? I'm a bit bemused by the problem as even thought the Yokozuna cable is slightly thicker than the original SRAM cable, the cable heads seem to be identical in size.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:05 pm 
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Once it's under tension, it will he held in the ratchet. Fiddling with it while it is loose doesn't really tel you anything because there's no force pulling on it to keep it in place.

Sram brand cables are 0.1mm narrower than standard shift cables, but regular ones will work just fine.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:30 pm 
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Location: Netherlands
[/quote]
Note I haven't tightened the cable to the rear derailleur yet, it's still hanging free once it leaves the housing.
[/quote]

Any shifter, regardless of brand, should not be "dry" shifted with an unloaded cable. As in shifted without being tensioned. While not likely to cause any real damage what you describe is a typical outcome, cable head comes out of where it should be and could end up stuck in an odd place which can then become a mess. As sigismond noted once under tension all good but whenever a bike is dry shifted it's a good idea to make sure things are back where they should be especially if something feels stuck. As long as you make sure things are reseated correctly then unlikely any harm done.

By very fuzzy memory Campy had a warning sticker on the shifter regarding this many years ago. And if you really want to piss off a shop wrench randomly shift bikes on display, does basically the same thing. I remember digging a stuck cable head out of a then "new" Ultegra 9 speed-first and only STI shifter I will ever take apart.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:44 am 
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Cosmo wrote:
Any shifter, regardless of brand, should not be "dry" shifted with an unloaded cable. As in shifted without being tensioned. While not likely to cause any real damage what you describe is a typical outcome, cable head comes out of where it should be and could end up stuck in an odd place which can then become a mess. As sigismond noted once under tension all good but whenever a bike is dry shifted it's a good idea to make sure things are back where they should be especially if something feels stuck. As long as you make sure things are reseated correctly then unlikely any harm done.

By very fuzzy memory Campy had a warning sticker on the shifter regarding this many years ago. And if you really want to piss off a shop wrench randomly shift bikes on display, does basically the same thing. I remember digging a stuck cable head out of a then "new" Ultegra 9 speed-first and only STI shifter I will ever take apart.

Funny you should mention that, as I had to dig the original SRAM cable head out of an inside corner shifter body before putting the Yokozuna cable in. This required taking the faceplate off.

Isn't it nice that SRAM shifter bodies are so easily serviced?


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Posted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:44 am 


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:31 pm 
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I had a similar problem with a second hand pair of levers I bought, I stripped them down (much easier than Campag and next to impossible with Shimano) and I realised a couple of the circlips were missing on the gear lever mechanism. Sourced some new ones very easily and cheaply (just a standard sized circlip), cleaned all the parts and put back together and its as crisp as when new. The double tap shifters can be stripped and rebuilt in less than 20 mins per lever once you've got the hang of it, also parts such as springs are easily available from Sram. A big plus over the other manufacturers in my mind (although Campag aren't too bad).


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