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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:40 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:47 pm
Posts: 1697
Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
The SL218 has just a little more flange spacing, on the order of .5mm, on the DS than the SL211. Since lacing heads in on the SL211 has just enough clearance as it is (for Sram, 7900 has a little more clearance on its deralleur), I would not suggest lacing 1x heads in on the SL218.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:22 am 
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hl219 wrote:
I'm planning on building a 24h Velocity A23 rear wheel with a BHS SL218 hub. Can anyone give me advice on the lacing pattern? I'm going to use Sapim Lasers all around, I was thinking either 1xDS/2xNDS or 2xDS/2xNDS. Also, would using the offset version of the A23 help/hinder even tension on the rear wheel with either lacing pattern?
... I only weigh about 62kg and being a woman I don't put so much power down either, so I figured 24h would be sufficient for the rear. If I went 2x both DS and NDS with the offset rim do you think my configuration would work, or should I change spoke count or use Sapim Race instead of Lazers or something?

Hi hl219, 24H 12-12 2xDS 2xNDS will give you the strongest, most durable, most responsive wheel but with you being very light (62kg) 2xDS 1xNDS (heads in) will be ok, also.

Also, you could use the BHS SL218 16-8 hub, 24H A23 rim, and a 3xDS 0xNDS(heads in) lacing which should produce a strong and very responsive wheel :)

Sapim Lazers or CXray are a good choices. CXray are better and easier to build with ...

thanks KL :)


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Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:22 am 


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 Post subject: Kinlin XR-200 or XR-19W
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:05 am 
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Posts: 14
I apologize in advance if this has been covered. I've learned a ton from this thread!

The marketing literature for the 19W makes it sound as if it is substantially better than the 200. Ie, a little heavier, but a little wider, stronger, and eyelets for an easy build. However, I've read some posts about them having a low maximum tension rating and being fairly 'soft'.

I weigh 160 lbs and do a lot of hills/steady state riding but I like to periodically sprint. I'm not an overly powerful rider (250 watt FTP, 1200 watt sprint), but I'm planning on a 24/28 build on one of these 2 rims. I currently run HED Belgium C2 rims. Front (24 spoke, radial, WI H2 hub) and rear (24 spoke, 2x both sides, Powertap SL+ hub). This has been a super solid set of wheels, but I got a great deal on a crank-based power meter, so I'm going to sell them and will need something to replace them with and was hoping to build something that was lighter but equally strong.

Here's what I was planning.

Front:
Kinlin XR-200, XR-19W, or possibly an Alpha 340 if it's worth the extra cost
BHS SLF71W 24 hole hub
24 Sapim Laser spokes laced radially
24 Sapim brass nipples

Rear:
Kinlin XR-200, XR-19W, or possibly an Alpha 340 if it's worth the extra cost
Novatec 482SB-SL 28 hole hub (chosen over the BHS rear hubs due to better flange spacing/tension balance)
14 Sapim Laser spokes laced 2x NDS
14 Sapim Race spokes laced 2x DS (can I do 1x heads in with this hub?)
28 Sapim brass nipples

Thanks,
Bob


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:13 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:25 pm
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Location: Glermsford, Suffolk U.K
Well to put this in perspective. Soft just means flexible. This can be overcome with hubs that give good bracing angles, this is the single most important thing when building with light weight rims and light weight spokes both of which are not inherantly stiff.

I use pair of 28H Kinlin XR-200's built with Laser spokes. I have sed Novatec A291 and F482 hubs as they give decent bracing angles.
Bracing angle is far more important then tension balance I have found.
Your proposed build with 28H rim on the rear and F482 hubs with laser NDS and Race DS laced in a 2x pattern will be fine. 1x DS heads in is just not worth it I think, I have never done it as if I felt a bild needed 2x lacing on the rear to make it work, I would pick another spoke, hub, rim combination that could use 2x or 3x lacing on the rear.

Brass nipples are fine but alloy seem to work well for me, just get the spoke lengths correct. While some do not like the quality of the XR-200 rim I have found nothing wrong with them. They seen to give even tension builds and are of cosnitent weight. Given the price difference between the XR-200 and the Stan's Alpha 340, I would se the XR-200, it's a decent rim.

I have never bilt with the XR-19W so I cannot comment on that. I will add my I might pt out similar ammount of power to you but as I do not have a powermeter I really cannot say.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:39 pm 
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Posts: 1697
Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
1x heads in DS is a hack to increase DS effective flange spacing on hubs that don't have much. If you do it on a hub with decent flange spacing you'll probably have spoke to derailleur collisions.

I've also not had a problem with alu nipples. I think I have partially rounded one, and that was due to being careless with the spoke wrench and not making sure it was fully seated before appling torque. Brass do turn a little easier but using some grease on the nipple takes care of that.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:17 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:49 am
Posts: 14
Thanks for the input guys. Based on a couple of other conversations, I decided to go with the 19W. Haven't built wheels with eyletted rims before, so I want to try it.

I went 20/24 which I may regret, but the WW in me really wanted a sub 1350g build.

Ordered it all from bikehubstore.com today. Looking forward to getting these built!

Bob


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:25 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 9:07 pm
Posts: 967
Location: Slovenia---that forest land
KLabs wrote:
Hi kavitator, thanks for the information. Yes, 125kg DS and 55-65kg NDS (NDS tension ratio of 44% to 52%) is nothing special is it, but 17mm aluminium axle, etc sounds good :)

Have you noticed if the 2 piece hub has affected stiffness or responsiveness in anyway ...

l


Hello - ok some news on BARTIME powerflange hubs -
After first rides wheelset is very stiff - but it is 60mm carbone tubular (open mould) 16 spokes front; 20 spokes rear (Cx rays). Stiffer than same wheelset on Novatec hubs.

What first was noticed was very very smooth running and stiffnes (test rider is 75kg ex elite racer - now one of the best amateur racers). Lacing is little different from ordinary hubs - you must remove left flange to insert spokes - but it is not tough job. Now we wait for some 10.000km on them.

cheers

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:11 am 
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kavitator wrote:
KLabs wrote:
Hi kavitator, thanks for the information. Yes, 125kg DS and 55-65kg NDS (NDS tension ratio of 44% to 52%) is nothing special is it, but 17mm aluminium axle, etc sounds good :)
Have you noticed if the 2 piece hub has affected stiffness or responsiveness in anyway ...

Hello - ok some news on BARTIME powerflange hubs -
After first rides wheelset is very stiff - but it is 60mm carbone tubular (open mould) 16 spokes front; 20 spokes rear (Cx rays). Stiffer than same wheelset on Novatec hubs.

What first was noticed was very very smooth running and stiffnes (test rider is 75kg ex elite racer - now one of the best amateur racers). Lacing is little different from ordinary hubs - you must remove left flange to insert spokes - but it is not tough job. Now we wait for some 10.000km on them.
cheers

Thanks kavitator, is that running 10 or 11spd cassette?
What rear spoke lacing did you use?
So you need to remove the left flange even when using CXrays ... is this correct?

thanks KL :)


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:45 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 9:07 pm
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Location: Slovenia---that forest land
One rear i try with cx rays and complete hub - it can go but spokes must be be bend a lot - but not to damage them. With thicker spoke i dont think it will go. It is much easyer with flange removed

i photo wrong side of hub- but it shows
Image

rear 20 spokes i used 2x on DS and radial on NDS
rear 24 spokes i used 2x both sides

Wheels were for 10speed shimano

cheers

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:54 pm
Posts: 637
Location: Reading, UK
bm0p700f wrote:
The Novatec F482SB (HG) and F582SB (ED10) is 245g. The rear hub has PCD DS =49mm and NDS =41mm and flange seperation DS =18mm and DS = 37mm. Drilling 20H, 24H and 28H. The SL version is 230g. The freehub body is easily replaced with 2x 5mm allen keys. There is no preload adjustment on these. They seem pretty durable though. Freehub bodies are pretty cheap as well.


This is quoting a post from back in January because it references a hub I am interested in. Can anyone confirm whether the Novatec rear hub F582SB for Campagnolo will take 11-speed cassettes?


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:09 pm 
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It does.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:14 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 11:43 am
Posts: 450
I just bought myself some NOS Campagnolo omega strada hardox rims and I am looking for 36h hubs to mate them. I was after the record hubs but apparently they stopped making these in 36holes. I can't stretch my budget to chris king unfortunately. I was thinking of the Hope Pro3 Mono hubs unless there is some other recommendation?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:42 am 
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Location: Estonia
only front 36h
http://www.bike-components.de/products/ ... Nabe-.html

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:26 am 
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Posts: 292
astranoc wrote:
I just bought myself some NOS Campagnolo omega strada hardox rims and I am looking for 36h hubs to mate them. I was after the record hubs but apparently they stopped making these in 36holes. I can't stretch my budget to chris king unfortunately. I was thinking of the Hope Pro3 Mono hubs unless there is some other recommendation?


White Industries? Only handled their fronts personally but there's a lot of love for their T11, and it costs less than a CK.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:02 pm 
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Posts: 9
I would like to get some input on my next project. I am going to be building up as set of Enve 3.4 clinchers with an Alchemy ELF front hub and Powertap G3 rear hub using Sapim X-ray spokes and pillar nipples. These are going to be my do it all wheels so strength, durability and performance are my concerns.

For the front wheel I am planning on doing a radial lacing pattern. What do you folks think of heads in verse heads out? I know radial lacing looks cool but what do you think of a 1x pattern for the front wheel. Is there a performance benefit?

For the rear wheel the plan was to do a 2x pattern on both sides, which happens to be the powertap recommendation. Then I read the hub review over at fairwheel bikes. The fairwheel suggestion is a 1x DS with heads in. So I am thinking I might do a 1x DS heads in and 2x NDS. I wanted to hear what everyone thinks before I commit to this build.


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Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:02 pm 


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