KLabs wrote:
WinterRider wrote:
Edd shows 52% NDS tension with a 32 hole DT Swiss 240S. To arrive at left side kgf for 12.. to date I've used the left side ratio times the kgf for the right in 32H format.. and then divided by the spoke number left.
Has been accurate for what I have assembled.. with some adjustment for all outbound or inbound spokes NDS.
The DT Swiss scenario gives 62 kgf NDS for a normal laced 32H.. goes to 83 kgf lacing 12 left... assuming 120 DS tension.
Hi WinterRider, interesting and exciting ... (120 * 0.52) * (16/12) = 83.2kgf
Lets workout a lacing we would like to try and build it (with your 5500 hub)
Hey WinterRider, Calnago and bm0p700f are absolutely right, but I wish they had suggested a NDS spoke lacing for a 16:12 arrangement
There are articles out there but you need to do alot of reading to find the information
Without >6 degrees NDS bracing angle (more like >7.5), and even though NDS tension is 44%, the wheel would not be laterally stiff.
Because DS bracing angles are so small ( <4% ) the NDS brazing angle becomes critical.
It would appear that the closer the NDS bracing angle is to 6 degrees the more the DS brazing angle needs to be closer to 6 degrees.
You could say that the DS and NDS brazing angles need to add upto about >=12 degrees
The issue with reducing DS brazing angle and increasing NDS brazing angle is that the NDS spoke tension proportionally drops by the same ratio
- If DS bracing is 4 degrees and NDS is 8 degrees and the DS/NDS spokes are equal (16:16, 12:12), then DS spoke tension of 120kgf and NDS will be 60kgf.
- If DS bracing is 4 degrees and NDS is 12 degrees and the DS/NDS spokes are equal (16:16, 12:12), then DS spoke tension of 120kgf and NDS will be 40kgf ...
Using DT Swiss 240S hub, 130mm OLD, rim ERD 555mm, 32H 16:16 hub/rim, will give a 52% NDS ratio ... if DS spoke tension of 120kgf then NDS will be about 62kgf
- for 3x pattern ... DS bracing is 3.6 degrees and NDS is 6.9 degrees ... Total Bracing angle = 3.6 + 6.9 = 10.5 degrees (good torque control, average lateral wheel stiffness)
- for 1x pattern ... DS bracing is 3.8 degrees and NDS is 7.3 degrees ... Total Bracing angle = 3.8 + 7.3 = 11.1 degrees (average torque control, better than average lateral wheel stiffness)
- Spoke pattern affect Torque Control (Climbing/Sprinting) and Bracing Angle
- Flange diameter (Spoke Circle Ø) affects Bracing Angle ... especially the DS flange Spoke Circle Ø due to DS bracing angle being <6 degrees
- DS/NDS Bracing Angles affect a wheels lateral stiffness
A hub with wider Flange spacing (FTF) would be better ... ie. NDS flange offset (LCF or CLF) > 34mm and FTF > 54mm ... such as the Novatec = 38mm/56mm, BHS SL211 = 37.75mm/54.5mm, and others ...
The Chris King Classic Cross 130 OLD hub is interesting in that CLF = 37.3mm, CRF = 17.2mm, FTF = 54.5mm, Spoke Circle Ø = 53mm/53mm
- 3xDS 3xNDS 16:16 ... Total Bracing Angle = 3.7 + 7.9 = 11.6 degrees (good/excellent torque control, good lateral wheel stiffness)
- 2xDS 2xNDS 16:16 ... Total Bracing Angle = 3.8 + 8.2 = 12.0 degrees (good torque control, good/excellent lateral wheel stiffness)
Theoretically, if our hypothesis is correct, using a 32H hub, 130mm OLD, 28H Rim ERD 555m, CLF = 40.0mm, CRF = 16.0mm, FTF = 56.0mm, Spoke Circle Ø = 53mm/53mm, NDS Ratio = 40%
- if DS spoke tension = 120kgf, then NDS spoke tension = (120 * 0.40) * (16/12) = 64.0kgf, Corrected NDS Ratio = 53% (just an acceptable NDS spoke tension/detension stiffness ratio)
- 3xDS 3xNDS 16:12 lacing ... Total Bracing Angle = 3.4 + 8.5 = 11.9 degrees (good torque control, good lateral wheel stiffness)