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 Post subject: First Custom Wheelset
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:08 pm 
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Location: Portland, Oregon
I'm considering building a custom set of wheels opposed to buying a nice set of 1400-1500 gram mavics

I want to go with king hubs and possibly he'd rims. Any issues with going radial laced on the front?

Any other rim recommendations?


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 Post subject: First Custom Wheelset
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:08 pm 


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 Post subject: First Custom Wheelset
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:15 pm 
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Location: Mississippi
See wheelbuilding thread......all the info you'd ever want and more.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:46 pm 
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if you want carbon ENVE and Zipp are nice. the Smart System 3.4 is sweet. (looks like the below picture when laced to King 45's in mango with DT aerolites, radial laced on the front. This is my buddy from work's bike and he's well pleased with the setup.) The 202's/303's are good choices from Zipp for all-around wheels too...


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69481_3795211932861_1503529249_n.jpg [ 70.03 KiB | Viewed 1132 times ]

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:23 pm 
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Location: McCall, ID
photocycler wrote:
I'm considering building a custom set of wheels opposed to buying a nice set of 1400-1500 gram mavics

I want to go with king hubs and possibly he'd rims. Any issues with going radial laced on the front?

Any other rim recommendations?



Radial is fine on the R45 front. For rims, maybe take a look at the Velocity A23 OC. I built those into R45s a few weeks back and I was quite impressed with the DS/NDS tension ratio.

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 Post subject: The wheelbuilding thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:11 am 
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Location: Portland, Oregon
I should mention I want to stay less then 1200. Thinking I would also go with Sapim spokes


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:15 am 
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Winter rider- so long as spokes have tension it is my understanding that wheel stiffness (any type) is independent of spoke tension. Most of the radial stiffnees is down to the inherent stiffnes of the rim anyway.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:23 am 
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photo cycle. Less than 1200g. That not going to happen with CK hubs or a clincher rim like the A23. You would need 20F/24R Kinlin XR 200's, very light hubs and light gauge spokes to get that weight. You will have a wheel that will flex alot and proabbly have a short life.

A 1400-1500g wheelset that is stiff and durable is easily attainable. It get harder below 1400g

If you are no more than 80kg and ride on smoothish roads a 1300g Kinlin XR-200 wheelset is doable.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:35 am 
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@photocycle- I understand that you may want to get under 1200 grams, but at that point you may be sacrificing performance. I think that going with a slightly heavier build will give you more rigidity and a better ride quality.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:39 am 
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WinterRider wrote:
... And while the trial 18-10 I built is not a true triplet.. the concept is of course same. That wheel feels very strong.. but riding it will tell the actual story.

Caveats for the triplets of course... center drilled rims are needed. And the next one I'll lace NDS all heads in 1x... aiming to minimize the NDS flange strain.

Hi WinterRider, how did you lace the 10 spoke NDS? In theory, with 10 spokes you can lace 1x, and even 2x, but you did this with a 18H flange so the holes are not evenly spaced for 10 spokes so it will be interesting to see the results of your efforts :-)


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 Post subject: The wheelbuilding thread
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:10 am 
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Location: Portland, Oregon
Sorry under $1200 US , I am happy to between 1400-1500 grams


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:01 am 
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Location: Glermsford, Suffolk U.K
There is no need to spend so much though. Rims and spokes will only take up so much of the budget, you will be blowing most of the build on hubs. I do think CK hubs are too expensive for what they are. Using DA hubs (7900 can still be bough new) in a 24-28H drilling, A23 rims and CX-ray spokes would be chepaer option and weight in with alloy nipples at around 1530g. That would be a good build so long as you are not too heavy or too powerfull. The Archetype rim will add a some more grams but would be stiffer.

The DT Swiss RR440 might be a good rim to use though but we have yet to see it in the U.K.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:30 pm 
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photocycler wrote:
I'm considering building a custom set of wheels opposed to buying a nice set of 1400-1500 gram mavics

I want to go with king hubs and possibly he'd rims. Any issues with going radial laced on the front?

Any other rim recommendations?


So the trick is keeping the post short hey...
My post on the last page could've said something along the lines of photocycler's post, only I don't really know where to start. I'm ~80kg, hoping to replace a set of Ksyrium sl's with a custom set around 1300-1400g with similar if not better performance, but much better aero. Is it possible to achieve this well under phoocycler's stated $1200 budget (cheaper than the Ksyriums on sale)? Suggestions on a components as a starting point would be much appreciated (obviously I'll pay attention to suggestions for photocycler too).


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:53 pm 
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bm0p700f wrote:
Winter rider- so long as spokes have tension it is my understanding that wheel stiffness (any type) is independent of spoke tension. Most of the radial stiffness is down to the inherent stiffness of the rim anyway.


I'll check to that.. given your experience. And it's the prevailing view on this thread it seems.

I'll hold out.. in one regard. Heavy usage.. hard impacts.. I suspect spoke tension becomes an issue per radial stiffness. I consider kgf per unit of area for the rim as another. More simply stated: total of the kgf for all the spokes vs the actual area of the rim size. How valid that is... I've not a clue.

As time permits.. I'll continue to go back and review this thread. Definitely the best thread I have found online per the subject.. by many miles/kms. Kudos to all of you :thumbup: contributing.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:05 pm 
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KLabs wrote:
WinterRider wrote:
Hi WinterRider, how did you lace the 10 spoke NDS? In theory, with 10 spokes you can lace 1x, and even 2x, but you did this with a 18H flange so the holes are not evenly spaced for 10 spokes so it will be interesting to see the results of your efforts :-)


Pic of the 18-10 is on page 257 of this thread: http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=74564&p=958089#p958089

36H hub was used. One 'soft' spoke did result.. as there's a sequence of 1-1-1 rather than the 2-1-2.. that spoke is around 90 kgf. Otherwise 120 kgf both sides.

To reiterate: I'm evaluating the triplet per my weight range. How many spokes is enough? Will a 24H work given the spoke and rim up to the task.. at what component weight.


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Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:05 pm 


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:50 pm 
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Location: Glermsford, Suffolk U.K
Kgf per unit are is pressue essentially which is stress when applied to solid.

In a hard impact the spoke can go slack and in those circumstances the radial stiffness will drop a bit. Increasing the spoke tension will mean more load is required to make the spokes go slack, it can't increase the stiffness of a wheel though. That is entirely determined in a tensioned wheel by the lenght of the spokes and the stiffness of the components. Those material properties are not effect by tension.

All pre stressed system are "stronger" than unstressed one think of heat treated shatter proof glass. The heat treatment put the surface in compression therefore a higher bending load is required to break the glass. The material properties of the glass are the same (or nearly the same) but the pre tension is the bit that gives it its toughness.

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