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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:03 pm 
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Maybe it is allready mentioned in this topic but could not find it. Can somebody of the Rapha fans tell me how it fitts comparing to Assos. Assos wears small and I have to pick one size bigger. How about Rapha? Is it tailored fit or regular fit? All information would be nice. Thanks in advance.

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:03 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:46 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:57 pm
Posts: 82
Location: Denver
poppiholla wrote:
Maybe it is allready mentioned in this topic but could not find it. Can somebody of the Rapha fans tell me how it fitts comparing to Assos. Assos wears small and I have to pick one size bigger. How about Rapha? Is it tailored fit or regular fit? All information would be nice. Thanks in advance.


Rapha fits on the small side. Usually I'm a small, but in Rapha it depends (partly on how fat I am at the time). Sometimes you have to try the smaller and send it back, but they are pretty quick and send you a label ahead of time (in the States at least). It's easier if you can go to the dealer, but the one Rapha dealer in my area is not terribly close (I live in the city, it's in Boulder and I don't drive really) and they don't always have what I want to try out.

Most of my Rapha gear is Medium at the moment.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:55 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:23 am
Posts: 63
Pro Team is not as "boxy" as the Classic. In U.S., you can simply order anything that you are interested, try them on at home, and return whatever (or all) that you don't like. They pay for returned shipping by enclosing a UPS label in your original order.

Pro Team bibs have the label "made in Italy".

I have plenty of Rapha now, and sold all the Assos on ebay (btw, why the hell would people buy USED bibs?)

Capo, castelli...etc tried them all.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:29 pm 
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The Pro Team/Sky stuff is designed to be skin tight so you might want to size up if you prefer something less form revealing. I wear everything Rapha in medium except for the Pro Team jerseys which feels/looks perfect as a large. My medium Assos jersey is tighter than a non Pro Rapha medium. I'd say you'd fit the same size from both companies but Assos would be slightly tighter.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:53 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:17 am
Posts: 66
Gem wrote:
Beyond the arcteryx veilance line which is made in Canada can someone give me an example of a company of a similar size to Rapha that manufactures technical clothing in North America? By technical I mean waterproof or windproof garments constructed out of North American milled; oil-based, synthetic fabrics.

Having worked in the rag trade for thirteen years it appears that the global reality of garment manufacturing is passing a few of you by. Any company that wants to bring technical clothing to market on a relatively large scale for a reasonable (I.E. not Veilance) price has little choice but to manufacture in SE Asia. If you think that a factory that's signed up to the Fair Wear Foundation is bad I suggest you take a trip to the factories in Bangladesh or Vietnam if you want an idea of how exploited workers are & how horrific working conditions can be. Further; if a cosmetic stitch line is applied in Italy to a Chinese constructed pair of jeans you will read Made in Italy on the label & in the last few years sweatshops that would shame SE Asia have been found in Manchester: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7824291.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'm not sure about the States but quality, large-scale UK garment manufacturing beyond knitwear ended in the mid-eighties following the heyday of UK outdoor design and innovation. We do not have the expertise to manufacture technical garments here, the quality would be lower and the price higher for items that China have become experts at turning out over the last thirty years.

I can see that Rapha's message could be considered disingenuous by some but this is 2012 & that's marketing, cycling is far from immune.


Acronym manufactures technical garments (Gore-Tex Pro/Active) in the EU.

www.acronym.de

I have a several Acronym items and can speak to their extreme quality. FYI, I have no affiliation.

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:37 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:57 pm
Posts: 82
Location: Denver
RudyMontana wrote:

Acronym manufactures technical garments (Gore-Tex Pro/Active) in the EU.

http://www.acronym.de" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have a several Acronym items and can speak to their extreme quality. FYI, I have no affiliation.

Cheers,


Except, of course, that the materials (uh, Gore 2-layer laminate, nylon, buckles, etc) are mostly made in SE Asia. I have a friend in the backpack/bag industry and I've seen him point out the suppliers of particular buckles or fabrics time and time again. (He actually has an Acronym jacket from a few years ago too, but that's just a funny coincidence.)

But that's a red herring. The point is, not many people do this in the bike industry and some that do, don't do the best job (I have some Shutt VR stuff and it's... okay.) Criticizing Rapha for it is more ignorance than anything.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:08 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:12 pm
Posts: 137
I think this "how does it fit?" question I hear is a bit wrong. I think it they design it and call it a medium, and you wear mesium in all your other clothing and you get it and it's tight it's because it's supposed to be tight.

Bike clothing is supposed to be much tighter than you'd wear elsewise, much tighter than I think people realize.

$2500 carbon rims for aerodynamics?

$10000 for 11 lb bike to get you you'll that much quicker?

Don't make it all pointless by wearing something any looser than you have too.

You should judge fit by waist and arm length more than snugness.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:56 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:17 am
Posts: 66
[/quote]

Except, of course, that the materials (uh, Gore 2-layer laminate, nylon, buckles, etc) are mostly made in SE Asia. I have a friend in the backpack/bag industry and I've seen him point out the suppliers of particular buckles or fabrics time and time again. (He actually has an Acronym jacket from a few years ago too, but that's just a funny coincidence.)

But that's a red herring. The point is, not many people do this in the bike industry and some that do, don't do the best job (I have some Shutt VR stuff and it's... okay.) Criticizing Rapha for it is more ignorance than anything.[/quote]

I am simply making the point that there is reputable manufacturers of high tech garments still in industrialized, developed, 1st world nations w/ manufacturing standards and pedigree.

I like Rapha, especially their Jerseys/Socks/Bags etc. I recently purchased their 'Hardshell' Jacket. This is what I would describe as one of their more technical offerings. I have yet to put many miles on it but I am curious how it will compare to a Gore-Tex Active in terms of its waterproofing/breathability.

At the end of the day Rapha chooses to manufacture in China and so do a lot of other companies. Thats is what it is. That said, I would think more highly of Rapha as a brand if they manufactured domestically.

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:39 pm 
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Just to restate my original point: "By technical I mean waterproof or windproof garments constructed out of North American milled; oil-based, synthetic fabrics." As Mattydubs points out the fabrics Acronym use will be milled in China.

Beyond that comparing Acronym with Rapha is hardly comparing apples with apples. There's a massive discrepancy in RRPs (455 Euros for a beanie, not even Rapha could get away with that) and I would question if they've got comparable turnover but admit that's just a hunch. I seriously doubt the cycling market would support a brand making thousand Euro jackets but given the huge sums of money people spend on it these days again I could be wrong.

It's rather myopic to think that all of a company's products are made in one Country and I'd be very surprised if that's the case with Rapha. If they're anything like most other clothing companies then they'll weigh-up quality, margin and what the market's prepared to pay for one of their garments and make a decision based on the relationship between those things.

As a side point Chinese manufacturer isn't the high-margin panacea that some seem to believe. Making things half way round the World in an unreliable factory is a QC nightmare unless you've got a production agent on site all the time. This is recommended reading if you'd like to know more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poorly_Made_in_China


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:16 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:12 pm
Posts: 137
So it's a quality control nightmare(qc? Really dude?) than maybe their quality sucks.

It doesn't all have to be made in one country but it sure shouldn't include china.

All my Giordana is from Italy.
I have assos from Bulgaria, Switzerland, Italy and maybe one other place. Those are all countries I'd want to ride a bike. They are also E.U. Or close enough, so they have good labour standards. $250 for a shirt is a lot. It's rediculous if it's made in China.

I used I like designer clothes, it used to be Prada was all made in Europe and it was all quality. Now most is from China and it's overpriced crap. It just didn't last, at all. So you shouldn't buy it. It's very simple.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:55 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:17 am
Posts: 66
Gem wrote:
Just to restate my original point: "By technical I mean waterproof or windproof garments constructed out of North American milled; oil-based, synthetic fabrics." As Mattydubs points out the fabrics Acronym use will be milled in China.

Beyond that comparing Acronym with Rapha is hardly comparing apples with apples. There's a massive discrepancy in RRPs (455 Euros for a beanie, not even Rapha could get away with that) and I would question if they've got comparable turnover but admit that's just a hunch. I seriously doubt the cycling market would support a brand making thousand Euro jackets but given the huge sums of money people spend on it these days again I could be wrong.

It's rather myopic to think that all of a company's products are made in one Country and I'd be very surprised if that's the case with Rapha. If they're anything like most other clothing companies then they'll weigh-up quality, margin and what the market's prepared to pay for one of their garments and make a decision based on the relationship between those things.

As a side point Chinese manufacturer isn't the high-margin panacea that some seem to believe. Making things half way round the World in an unreliable factory is a QC nightmare unless you've got a production agent on site all the time. This is recommended reading if you'd like to know more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poorly_Made_in_China" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


I am beating a dead horse here I concede but Acronym manufactures jackets made with Schoeller in the EU. Schoeller is milled in Switzerland. Expensive, yes but thats not the point. I am trepidacious buying anything made in China especially when its got a price tag north of $400 CDN (like their hardshell). As you stated, QC can be a nightmare...

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:41 pm
Posts: 30
I'm not really sure where to start but having spent 12 years in sourcing for a few companies you'll have to forgive my use of jargon.

You think your original Prada was fabricated by Nonna? More likely it was put together by North African or Chinese migrants in a Chinese controlled factory somewhere like Prato:

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/a ... 2003491450" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/no ... zhou-italy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not really sure where the anti-Chinese sentiment comes from but to discount all the clothing they produce because you don't want to ride a bike there is extraordinarily short-sighted. If you hate the Chinese and can't bear to wear anything they produce of course that's your choice but don't try and cloak that xenophobia in some kind of quality argument; they make good, bad and indifferent things just like everywhere else...


Northoceanbeach wrote:
So it's a quality control nightmare(qc? Really dude?) than maybe their quality sucks.

It doesn't all have to be made in one country but it sure shouldn't include china.

All my Giordana is from Italy.
I have assos from Bulgaria, Switzerland, Italy and maybe one other place. Those are all countries I'd want to ride a bike. They are also E.U. Or close enough, so they have good labour standards. $250 for a shirt is a lot. It's rediculous if it's made in China.

I used I like designer clothes, it used to be Prada was all made in Europe and it was all quality. Now most is from China and it's overpriced crap. It just didn't last, at all. So you shouldn't buy it. It's very simple.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:21 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:02 pm
Posts: 944
Location: EU
Does anyone have any discount codes that I might use? I think I've lost my merino hat in the pub, damn.

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:51 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:18 am
Posts: 41
Location: West Midlands, UK
Sorry, nothing to add on the actual clothing, but I LOVE this spoof rapha website (hope the link works)

http://internationale.teamjva.com/

PS: I'm not a rapha hater, but I do like a good spoof (and apparently rapha took it in their stride!).

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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:01 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:08 pm
Posts: 5
I like this quote from a Mottram interview:

"What we wanted to create was a brand for a certain type of person that was absolutely for that person. So it was everything to some people and nothing to some people. I didn't want to be something to everyone. I've spent so much time with clients trying to explain to them that you can't sit on the fence -- you want your brand to have a bit of side to it, a bit of tension. We're lucky to have customers who really like what we do and are like friends. But we also have a lot of detractors, and that's really good. It means we're getting things right, that we're creating impact in the right way, that we matter to people."

He has definitely succeeded in creating a polarizing brand - even as evidenced in this thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Rapha Clothing
Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:01 pm 


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