FYI all, the new 2013 Pinarello Dogma 65.1 Think 2 copies are already out and floating across Craigslist.



http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/bi ... 82687.html

I called this guy up and he was at least nice enough to tell me (after a little prodding) that it was a replica. When in doubt, buy from a trusted WW member or from a dealer.

I know that Pinarello is trying to crack down on fakes, but this is ridiculous.

Do they still stuff the steerer tubes with old Chinese newspapers?

I doubt it. I'm pretty sure the quality is okay, but no where near the level of refinement needed to make a high-end bike like this one. All I know is that if I'm descending at 45+ mph, the bike better hold up. I've got two kids and a wife that depend on me. I just wish we didn't have to navigate through a world of fakes. It would be so much easier if a spade was a spade. Greed gets the better of some people and it makes me

I know a guy on one of these. First day he took it out, he busted a carbon water bottle cage that came with it when he hit a bump. Sure hope that's not indicative of the quality of the frameset!

That's a pretty good fake. They're getting better, which is bad.
Chain is on backwards.
And that is the shortest stem on a MOST Talon bar I've ever seen. And I like the Lightweight wheels with steel spokes.

True words.
And this is nothing to get mad about tlow. The times when Chinese frames were cracking under load have long passed.
It is bad for the "original frame" myth as you get a "very,very close to the original one" but the huge price difference.

I think it is not only me not trusting western companies and their MD's endless arguments .

For years we have written Fizik to over think their Arione and other convex saddle designs and realize that a concave mid channel really brings relief to many, many cyclists.
They were stubborn to reply that fizik has its own "design philosophy" with wing flex etc.
Oh well, good to know that now you can buy a Arione Versus and other Fizik's with a mid channel.
So what is the "excuse" for years insisting on a single convex design?

And I expect more to come. Cycling shoes should be definitely a field our Chinese friends should keep an eye on.

Here's a new ebay listing of what I'm sure is a replica - says it was an unwanted gift from an uncle yet it is offered in 7 sizes......shesh!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pinarello-DOGMA ... 4ac012602a" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He uses a picture and description from Pinna (as he notes in auction that the color is green and white) so you really aren't seeing the frame he's attempting to sell.

How I picked on that was I watch for Campy Bora wheels......which is one of his other auctions - says in the auction that he doesn't sell fake items but they are absolutely fakes......someone with such intent to decieve on the wheels says the same for the frame (all 7 of them). I've reported the fake wheels to ebay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Campagnolo-Bora ... 4ac02132e3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

UPDATE - probably due to my report to ebay the seller now has changed some pictures and says he had replaced the Campy hubs with novatec.......hmmm....when the hell did Bora's come as clinchers with exposed nipples......what a scam.

2nd update - he changed pictures and description on the frame - saying now it's only a 54cm.......but Pinna's use a threaded BB and this looks like a pressfit....and given the SCAM nature of his fake Bora wheelset it's a shame that this goes on.

Fakes for sure. Or lets say this poor guy thinks his uncle would never give him some fakes as a gift.

Now I am very interested to see what eBay does. From my experience I must say that eBay is just after the money and does not care if fakes or a bunch of stolen items penetrate their pages.

is the fake dogma heavier than the original? i don't think so. this is the rare case where the original product is so lacking, than the fake one out-performs the original.

is anyone in this site still buying pinarellos?¿?¿

Yeah, checked it.
But this is what I am trying to say. How comes that eBay allows an update over the first installed photos for a reported item?

There is so much more to carbon frames than shape and weight. Like layup schedule, pressure, time, heat used, the resin used, type(s) of carbon fiber. Just because it looks like chicken and tastes like chicken does not make it chicken.

Greed, yeah, but on both ends. If nobody was just interesting just in showing off the Pina logo for as little dough as possible, then those would not exist.

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Bikes: Raceur, Beateur

Can't agree more.

In fact, the buying end is probably more to blame, as the selling end is making only $200-300, but the buying end is trying to pass it for a $6000 item.

Some say this won't affect Pinarello, but I will tell you my wealthier cycling friends are seldom considering it for their next bike solely because there are too many fakes floating around.

BTW, "I didn't die after riding 3 months" is no equivalent to passing rigorous tests that consist of tens of thousands of repetitions of pounding by heavy iron.

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wow! this is an ace!

I was looking for some handle bars a month or so ago and have now been getting some emails from a place called AliExpress.com They sell these "fakes" for about $625. You get the frame, fork, hs, bars, seat post, stem. You can pick up a complete bike with Ultegra for $2500!

I know there are quite a few folks out there with Chinese carbon frames and I personally considered buying one. However, I don't think I would buy one with all the logo's for another company plastered on it or one that is designed as a direct replica. Trust me there are ones out there that look like the Specialized as well as the Cervello. Personally, when the time comes to pull the trigger on a carbon frame, I will be buying the real deal. Just thought I would share.

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/PINARELL ... 99070.html

Pick your color, size, wheel type...hell, they will damn near make you whatever you want!

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09 Pinella w/ Record 10spd
http://1spd.blogspot.com/