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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:35 pm 
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Just finished a front build to give the rim a trial. Replacing a Kinlin 270 which pulsed while braking due to lateral uneveness. Both built radial, heads in, 20x.

Kinlin 270 weighed 440gr while the Archetype came in at 450gr.

Same front hub, C4 FH95. Spokes were DT Aerolites w/brass DT nipples on the Kinlin while the Archetype was built with Pillar bladed spokes with Pillar brass nipples. Spoke and nipple combination added another 10 grams. I've inserted a picture of the Kinlin and Archetype next to each other so you can see the width difference.

The rim drilling is offset, a nice touch and the reason I went with the Pillar nipples is that they have a hex end so I can tighten them from the inside when building using a t wrench. For me, this is a bit easier and you also don't mar the anodizing on the external part of the rim surface. They have a normal box shape on the external portion so they can be trued when tires are mounted. Finish on these rims is excellent. Kinlin the H son is like comparing Mavic to Ambrosio.

Total weight w/o skewers and rim strips came in at 675gr.

Just came back from my weekday ride of 30km. Usual front wheel is a Ambrosio Excellence rim, 36 and 3x, 14/15 db spokes with a Conti 4Season 700-25. Tire on the H Son is a Veloflex Criterium 700-22. First impressions as follows:

Road surface aberrations are a bit more muted but anything with amplitude was no different than any other wheel or tire.

The rim is quite stiff in terms of vertical compliance.

Braking surface is extremely flat and true.

Initial turn in when cornering is easier but more steering is required to get the same line.

So far, all good and if those Santa brings those Tune hubs, I'll be building a complete set for a new project in the works.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:07 pm 
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Picking up my new commuter tomorrow, which has these rims built to some Hope hubs. Fantastic quality rims.

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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:07 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:35 pm 
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Can you update us with photos down the road to show how the anodizing wears on the brake track? Always wondered what that ends up looking like after a season of braking.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:18 pm 
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nspace wrote:
Can you update us with photos down the road to show how the anodizing wears on the brake track? Always wondered what that ends up looking like after a season of braking.

I'm also curius about the anodizing brake track wears.

New they look awesome, but I am not convinced that it will stay like that for a long time.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:20 pm 
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This is not the best image, but it gives some idea of what the Archetype looks like after the anodizing has been worn off the brake tracks.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:25 pm 
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Location: Surrey UK
Anodizing wears out pretty quick.
And that's how they look after just above 1000km:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/90178027@N ... otostream/"

Nice rims, they hold up very well. There was just one small correction after first few rides. Since than :D on my face.
I laced them to mig/mag 70/170 with cx-rays and alu nipples. I'm about 200lb/90kg.

https://picasaweb.google.com/1016755715 ... ag170CxRay

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:32 pm 
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1415chris wrote:
Anodizing wears out pretty quick.


Ano coat wore off the rear rim I'd built up over the course of the first 150km ride. If your buying these rims you need to embrace the silver brake track :)


For some other comments & want of a better place to put them;

In terms of build & rim regularity they seem pretty even & balanced. On the 20h / 24h rims I built up the 24h was perhaps .5mm out of vertical across the joint (measuring using dial gauge on park ts-2).

Running 24h rear on a dt 240 with DBs makes for a slightly flexy build imo (@ 73kg rider weight, 6ft). Given this point & the spoking, I may well rebuild the rear to comp spokes to add some more structure to the strength on the DS - so perhaps some food for thought if your considering a build with this rim & eyeing the lower spoke counts.

Other notes are that the tire profile is wider than compared to firecrest404 rim - with a vernier caliper & pro3 michelins 23mm on both, the archetype has another 1.5mm width. I had been pretty convince from eyeballing the profile that the width was wider than the alpha340 with pro3 mounted, but the vernier says its the same fwiw...


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 3:53 am 
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@4145chris...haha, that's the build I'm looking at provided Santa's got the ching to make good on the hubs. At 56kg, I'm going 20/24 and will probably go with the Pillars. I'm thinking blue hubs, silver spokes and the gun metal finish.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 9:49 am 
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Hi all,

I have had mine on for about two weeks now and put about 200 miles on them and i think they are great. Yes the anodising wore off after about 100 miles, started after the first ride, but i didnt expect it to last long.

They are wide rims and my TRP breaks with new pads only just clear the rim (the rear was fine, but the front was tight with only a few mm to spare). I thought the front would rub as i expected the wheels to be a bit flexy but they are not at all, really tight and responsive (CX ray, CKR45, double X on the rear). I changed from a pair of Campy Shamals and I think I prefer the Archetype, they roll much faster (due to the hubs) and have better road feel. The only advantage of the Shamals is that they spin up faster but this could be because they are about 150g lighter. For a rebuildable, reliable winter wheel then I am more than happy with the H-Plus-Son.

Cheers,
Lig.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:43 am 
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Can anyone comment on the braking? I've heard that it is not machined, how does this effect the performance?

Lig wrote:
The only advantage of the Shamals is that they spin up faster but this could be because they are about 150g lighter.


Odd, These rims are actually lighter than the Shamal rims IIRC (450g vs 570g)

Lig wrote:
my TRP breaks

wow I didn't know TRP was that fragile, or did you mean brakes :smartass: [/sarcasm]

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 6:07 pm 
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verycreativeusername wrote:
Can anyone comment on the braking?



Does not feel like its machined. No problems making slow descents down icy looking 12% stuff though.

I'm using older green swiss stops atm which are a bit too hard on the rim, so getting quite a few metal flakes in the pads on the rear rim.. will swap out to softer new green pads which hopefully will sort this out. Its a fairly cheap rim though & Im using them in muddy crudy conditions so not really a problem either way.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 6:28 pm 
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Hi all,

The braking surface is not machined but brakes absolutely fine. I am using standard Shimano dura ace pads. I would not use the green stuff pads anymore as these are what wrecked my Shamal rims.

And yes 'verycreative', it should have been brakes not breaks! Sorry about that!!

I think its the CK hubs that add the weight. I was comparing the whole wheel set, the H-Plus-Son wheels were 150g heavier for the pair of wheels built, than the Shamals.

Cheers,
Lig.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:53 am 
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Location: Bristol, UK
There seems to be a weight difference between the Black finish and the grey/'hard-anodized' finish.

On this thread there are some quoted weights around 450g for the black ones. I had a pair of the grey ones built up a few weeks ago, 32 holes. The builder weighed several of them at 474g grams. That would tally with BHS' figures as well:

http://www.bikehubstore.com/H-Plus-Son- ... p/hpsa.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So it seems grey is heavier but will the finish last longer? S'pose only time will tell. The braking surface is machined on these too. The only pic i have right now:

Image


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 Post subject: 470 vs 450 weights
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:20 pm 
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I just got an email back from them. Newer production is 470 as they have put more material in the nipple bed. Older ones are at 450. There will be no difference in weight between the black and the grey ano except for normal mfr tolerances. If I were still in Shanghai my driver would have been heading out the Kunshan to get me some of the 450's. :)

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 Post subject: 470 vs 450 weights
Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:20 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:03 am 
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Location: Adelaide, Australia
Now that they are 470g, there is really no reason to buy these over the Kinlin XC-279 (BHS c472w) is there (apart from the finish)?

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