Who do you think is riding clean?

Questions about bike hire abroad and everything light bike related. No off-topic chat please

Moderator: Moderator Team

ticou
Posts: 459
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 3:31 pm

by ticou

It was them Hyperon Ultra's. I was having a spin of wheels i would like to upgrade to in my local boutique LBS. I put the ultra to half a revolution and left it to spin back and forth under the leverage of the plastic security label. Coming back from cuddling the other wheels two mins later it was still going back and forth.

I doubt Voekler broke sweat.

User avatar
MattSoutherden
Posts: 1377
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 7:22 pm
Location: London

by MattSoutherden

Who do you think is riding clean?

Well, I did manage to take a shower yesterday morning before the hill climb. :no1:
Snacking on carrot sticks - Where did it all go so wrong?
-
Finsbury Park CC

by Weenie


ultyguy
Posts: 2226
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:35 pm
Location: Geneva

by ultyguy

dolophonic wrote:Woah, people think Vokler is clean? talk about Donkey to thoroughbred !


Or everyone else just got a lot slower in the past few years.....

User avatar
jmilliron
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:03 pm
Location: San Francisco Peninsula

by jmilliron

SpoonMan wrote:Our friend Mr. Phinney started out at Trek-Livestrong, and we know Lance's involvement - as well as the known doper Axel Merckx. Do we throw him under the bus as well?


Lance Armstrong is a cheater and an asshole, but I can't believe his U23 team had any systematic doping. Can you imagine the potential fallout from that? Helping kids to dope? The risk is too great and the reward too small.

Out of the current peloton, I'd have to put Phinney on the top of my "most likely clean list".

On the flip side, I wouldn't list *any* grand tour GC rider. Even Tejay and Ryder. In a three week race, it seems easy to cheat a little and get a solid boost. Hard to believe clean riders are getting a chance to shine.
2013 Wilier Cento1 SR || 2009 Ridley Crossbow || 2011 Yeti AS-R 5 Carbon

User avatar
prendrefeu
Posts: 8580
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:32 pm
Location: Los Feliz, Los Angeles, California
Contact:

by prendrefeu

ultyguy wrote:
dolophonic wrote:Woah, people think Vokler is clean? talk about Donkey to thoroughbred !


Or everyone else just got a lot slower in the past few years.....


This.

Voeckler has been a consistent rider - in style and abilities - pretty much throughout his career. Recent years have shown the peloton slowing down. Voeckler doing better... yet it's still Tommy, training w/o a powermeter, rarely using a heart rate monitor, old school riding. Some people really hate his facial expressions or whatever, but he's a hell of a better rider than most people on this site and if anyone does get an opportunity to read the interviews (mostly in French, obviously) you'll find he's a really a genuine, stand up guy that has always fought against the omerta of the peloton.
Exp001 || Other projects in the works.

SpoonMan
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2011 2:53 am
Location: Adelaide, Australia

by SpoonMan

jmrillion - Kind of my point. Guilt by association is a slippery slope. Everyone in this God-forsaken sport is linked to an ex-doper of some sort - so we can't assume just because 'this guy was working with that guy' that he's juicing.

Gilbert under Taus is hardly different to Phinney under Merckx, Armstrong, and now riding for a team owned by Rihs and with Hincapie and Ballan.

To be clear, I don't think Phinney would touch that stuff with a ten-foot barge pole - but if we're playing 6 Degrees of Obfuscation then that's where people end up.
2011 Scott Addict R3 (DA groupset, Tune Skyline RR wheelset, Rotor 52/36 Q-Rings)
2008 Giant Trinity A1 (cheapass 50mm carbon clinchers)
No easy road goes anywhere worth going

User avatar
zebragonzo
Posts: 949
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:35 am

by zebragonzo

Interesting article from Brad McGee in which he claims that FdJ and CSC both helped him remain clean. Perhaps CSC wasn't all that bad?

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/how ... 28aif.html
Dimples: Laminar flow separates more easily from a surface than turbulent air. Delayed separation reduces drag. A groove perpendicular to the flow triggers laminar to turbulent conversion. A spinning object uses dimples so an edge always faces the flow.

KWalker
Posts: 5827
Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:30 pm
Location: Bay Area

by KWalker

SpoonMan wrote:Who's riding clean? Well, I would guess:
Gilbert (God, I hope so)
Not Cancellara (Too much time on CSC for my liking)
Do recreational drugs (Boonen, probably Sagan) count?
Cavendish would surely weigh less if he was on something
I can't see Hushovd being clean. Just can't. Sprinters that can climb smell off to me. Chuck Degenkolb in there too. Oscar Freire can go in that basket too.
Matt Goss is clean IMHO, because he can't really climb, and to be honest, he's not a spectacular sprinter either. Kittel, Renshaw, Ciolek and those guys fit in there.
That list of riders that floated around after one of the grand tours with a suspicion level of doping (I'm assuming related to the bio-passport) was interesting. Didn't it put Cuddles on the same level as Armstrong - and Denis Menchov way way up there? Knowing what we know now - makes fascinating re-reading.
We reckon Rogers is going to get ditched by Sky (or vice versa), what about EBH? Talk about either the greatest natural talent in years, or...
That's my opinion anyway. And that's all it is.


Degenkolb and Hushovd were both phenomenal U23 TT'ers with Hushovd winning worlds. I bet their FTPs are pretty damn high and they have success in the sprints because they're fresher at the end of the race. Neither are snappy and I could see both being clean. Freire always was extremely good at positioning. Coulda been dirty, but again wasn't anything absurd.

For all his great natural talent EBH still hasn't won anything major either. And these guys aren't coming from obscurity to the limelight overnight.

I think Gilbert could have doped at Lotto, but isn't at BMC. He has consistently had the same style all of his career, but gotten a bit more saavy with his abilities. You used to see him try to battle it out in bunch sprints, attack very early on the Poggio, etc., but now he knows when to go and really does the same damn thing in almost every race.
Don't take me too seriously. The only person that doesn't hate Froome.
Gramz
Failed Custom Bike

ultyguy
Posts: 2226
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:35 pm
Location: Geneva

by ultyguy

It's interesting seeing how some of the best pro sprinters actually were dominant junior TT-ers as mentioned above. You can throw Kittel in there too. They didn't even know he could sprint until they saw hit wattage numbers on a practice lead out.

I hope Hushovd is clean, I want to believe...I wonder what Vaughters thinks.

beardking
Posts: 261
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:22 pm

by beardking

given what we know is the us national team systematically doping really that unlikely

http://velonews.competitor.com/2000/12/ ... -speaks_79
Greg Strock: Really, the question should be “Why two years?” because it’s been two years since I realized what really took place … the cause of the end of my career. When my cycling career ended, I put my energies into going to school and then med school. It was in my second year of med school, in my pharmacology class, that I actually started studying the things that had been done to me and that’s when it hit me.

For the duration of my time on the team, I was told things were “vitamins” and “extract of cortisone,” things to help me recover and cleanse my system. Every single time I asked, “Is this legal? Is this safe?” because up until that point, I’d never even taken a multi-vitamin, I don’t think. I just kinda ate well, trained and went with it. So, when needles started to get involved I was leery. It was repetitively preached to me that it was safe, legal and these were vitamins. I mean how can you question vitamins? And I had no idea that there was no such thing as “extract of cortisone.”

VN: How old were you at the time?

GS: Seventeen. All of these events took place in 1990, so I went from being 17 at the beginning of the season to 18 in the middle of the year.

User avatar
boysa
Posts: 1417
Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 10:03 pm
Location: Back in the saddle...

by boysa

prendrefeu wrote:
ultyguy wrote:
dolophonic wrote:Woah, people think Vokler is clean? talk about Donkey to thoroughbred !


Or everyone else just got a lot slower in the past few years.....


This.

Voeckler has been a consistent rider - in style and abilities - pretty much throughout his career. Recent years have shown the peloton slowing down. Voeckler doing better... yet it's still Tommy, training w/o a powermeter, rarely using a heart rate monitor, old school riding. Some people really hate his facial expressions or whatever, but he's a hell of a better rider than most people on this site and if anyone does get an opportunity to read the interviews (mostly in French, obviously) you'll find he's a really a genuine, stand up guy that has always fought against the omerta of the peloton.


+1. He's one guy who I could see telling the team doctor to go &@$ himself.
"Deserve's got nothing to do with it." William Munny

User avatar
Velofreak
Posts: 66
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:15 am

by Velofreak

prendrefeu wrote:
ultyguy wrote:
dolophonic wrote:Woah, people think Vokler is clean? talk about Donkey to thoroughbred !


Or everyone else just got a lot slower in the past few years.....


This.

Voeckler has been a consistent rider - in style and abilities - pretty much throughout his career. Recent years have shown the peloton slowing down. Voeckler doing better... yet it's still Tommy, training w/o a powermeter, rarely using a heart rate monitor, old school riding. Some people really hate his facial expressions or whatever, but he's a hell of a better rider than most people on this site and if anyone does get an opportunity to read the interviews (mostly in French, obviously) you'll find he's a really a genuine, stand up guy that has always fought against the omerta of the peloton.


I think Voeckler is clean, and i think not wearing a heart rate sensor, for such a good climber, is a key to success in some stages to win them. Great rider. I don't like him though, but that doesn't matter.

Contador i´m not sure... but he won both giro and vuelta clean so, if i had to bet my life, i would say he is clean. schleck is clean, cancellara, cadel evans... Wiggins, Froome. With the biologic passport and current race tempo, I think most of the current winners are clean. Actually, I think the test machines now are beeping too much; 0,00000000005 of clembuterol for Contador, Frank Schleck for I don't know what diuretical medicine... I think current tests are too unfair.

The spanish rider recently banned, from rabobank, that guy was clearly doped... I think current riders are all clean. Good riders who doped in the past, like vinokurov, are now riding clean and winning too, like vinokurov... that means most of them can win clean, so they ride clean.

User avatar
HammerTime2
Posts: 5422
Joined: Thu May 04, 2006 4:43 pm
Location: Wherever there's a mountain beckoning to be climbed

by HammerTime2

Velofreak wrote:Contador i´m not sure... but he won both giro and vuelta clean
And you know he won the giro and the vuelta clean, how?
Velofreak wrote:so, if i had to bet my life, i would say he <Contador> is clean.
You're quite the gambling man.

54x11
Posts: 40
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:02 am

by 54x11

artray wrote:Name a rider who you think has not doped. Just a name no chat. I will start off with Armstrong :lol: Joking :wink:

Lemond


In the current pro peloton .... Greipel.

by Weenie


User avatar
Kjetil
Posts: 1328
Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 1:17 pm
Location: Hamar, Norway
Contact:

by Kjetil

There are strong indications that CSC was at two speeds, that riders were clean and others not. Hamilton was not, arvesen and julich were.
At the time you could win clean on a day or a one week stage but not a gt.

There are other riders than julich and cunego who once charged but stopped.

Interesting that there are quite a lot of clean riders at opqs these days, isn't it?
Bianchi-Campagnolo

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post