HOT: Active* forum members generally gain 5% discount at starbike.com store!
Weight Weenies
* FAQ    * Search    * Trending Topics
* Login   * Register
HOME Listings Blog NEW Articles FAQ Contact About




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 230 posts ] 
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 16  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 12:00 pm
Posts: 570
Location: Aarhus, Denmark
They are really nice! I had one and it stood up to so much abuse it was almost ridiculous. You might be able to find one for cheap on some of the various online sites.

_________________
"Stay cool and try to survive" A. Klier to the other members of the Garmin classics squad the night before P-R.


Top
 Profile  
 
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:09 pm 


Top
  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 1:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:24 pm
Posts: 335
Is there any clearcoat on that polished cannondale?

_________________
I Will make the leap


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 3:48 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:10 am
Posts: 1271
Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands
Thanks for the replies! I guess I can add the "alu frames offer no comfort" to the list, a myth that frequently pops up when I talk to other riders. It obviously ignores the fact that comfort is the combination of frame, wheels, spoke tension, tire pressure, saddle, even stifness of the handlebar.

_________________
And if I ever meet an aardvark, I'm going to step on its damn protruding nasal implement until it couldn't suck up an insect if its life depended on it.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:57 am
Posts: 60
Timo wrote:
... "alu frames offer no comfort" to the list, a myth that frequently pops up...


They also say "lots of road buzz" and "harsh ride quality." This is something I never really understood.

Quote:
... comfort is the combination of frame, wheels, spoke tension, tire pressure, saddle, even stiffness of the handlebar


Lets assume we have two identical bikes - components, wheels, etc., all the way up to the frame geometry. We will isolate just the frame for this argument - its material and the frame's design. One is carbon fiber, the other aluminum.

Good carbon fiber has a higher elastic modulus than aluminum, and therefore will flex less, be less compliant, and therefore be stiffer. A stiffer frame would translate to a harsher ride.

Then why is carbon fiber "more pleasant to ride"?

Two reasons: 1) the way the carbon is laid up, and 2) the design (shape) of the frame. These two go hand-in-hand in manufacturing a CF frame. Compliance is built into the frame via its design (curved seat/chain stays which "bend", various top/down tube shapes). However most of these forms do not hold stress well, and this is where the lay-up of the CF cloth is critical to give it structural rigidity. You get a strong stiff frame from the material; and a compliant one from the shape of the tubes and the design of the frame.

Early aluminum designs were done with straight tubing. These directed forces from the road along the lines of the tubing, resulting in a more "feel" for the road (i.e. road buzz). I think this is where aluminum got its bad reputation. An elegant solution was the "compact geometry" IMO. Yes it did make the frame a lot stiffer, but the extended seatpost allowed for more "flex" on the post, giving a reduced feeling of buzz on the saddle. Using a CF seatpost made it even better.

Today's hydroformed aluminum tubes allows manufacturers to the use tube shapes previously possible only in CF frames, giving aluminum frames similar ride characteristics to that of CF frames. Gone are the days of "harsh aluminum bikes."

I know there will be pundits and naysayers, and people with their own opinion against aluminum regardless of the facts that are presented. I can't win them all.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:34 pm
Posts: 173
Image
My made in the USA caad9. Its at 15.1 lbs. Love this bike. I see no need for carbon as I can hang up front without a problem. Been on many century rides and a couple 200k rides with no issues. I run veloflex with latex at around 100psi. Smooth comfortable ride. New build coming up so will swap rival bits for red. So just under 15lbs is the goal.
Sent from my A500 using Tapatalk 2


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:51 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:02 pm
Posts: 103
Location: England
so what do we think is better
Colombus XLR8R or deda em2?

_________________
yes, but how much does it weigh?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:21 am
Posts: 278
Also, what are peoples opinion about Gaulzetti Corsa? Some people always say, too expensive for just an aluminum frameset.
I feel for a semi-custom frame with ISP, Enve fork and headset using unique Deda tubing, ought to make for a great bike.

http://www.embrocationmagazine.com/stor ... etti-corsa


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:19 pm 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:08 am
Posts: 7464
Location: Geeeelong!
ecguevara, I've ridden bad frames made with all material.

Less to do with what it's made with, much more to do with who made it.

_________________
http://www.nicksquillari.com.au Forum Jedi


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:41 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:57 am
Posts: 60
Yes, ride quality is not just about the material. How the frame was made by whom plays a large part as well. An improperly designed and improperly built frame will ride poorly no matter what material was used to make it. Companies that do not invest in product R&D will have less superior (or should I say inferior) products at the end of the day.

Blaming the material used is just a sorry excuse IMO.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:43 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 2:20 am
Posts: 33
Location: SC, USA
LittleSprinter wrote:
Also, what are peoples opinion about Gaulzetti Corsa? Some people always say, too expensive for just an aluminum frameset.
I feel for a semi-custom frame with ISP, Enve fork and headset using unique Deda tubing, ought to make for a great bike.

http://www.embrocationmagazine.com/stor ... etti-corsa" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


I've heard nothing but good things about Gaulzettis. I don't think most people appreciate the work and attention to detail that goes into making a handmade frame like that. Like the saying goes: "You get what you pay for."

I sure hope Mickey shows up to this thread - this kind of stuff is right up his alley.

_________________
My Flickr Photostream


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:57 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:21 am
Posts: 278
Yeah I've been talking with those guys, pretty much have all the cost, geometry and color all ready to go, going to build it with my Campagnolo Record/Chorus 10v, Thomson components and probably do some handbuilt wheels (probably 303 tubulars with King R45s).

Their tubeset is custom from Deda, so I'd really like to know what the riding characteristics and what makes it unique?

But the frame is a present to myself for finishing graduate school, so I've got sometime before I get to pull the trigger.... But glad this topic came up, trying to get as much information as I can on these frames, this is going to be one of those "keep forever" bikes.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 3:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 187
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Stockie, From what I remember no there wasn't


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:24 am
Posts: 595
I'll have my own contribution to this thread when I get the build completed, but for now I just want to say my aluminium Trek 1500 is the most comfy bike I've ever had. This I expect it almost totally down to component choices - so my personal belief is that the frame has very little to do with overall ride quality.

However, I think that the idea that 'aluminium frames are so much harsher', is just a baseless rumour that's spread around the web and amongst riders that have just heard it elsewhere or have been convinced by the placebo effect. Like has been said already, it's more down to how the frame is made - I'd bet there are loads of carbon frames out there harsher than some aluminium ones, and it's down to the way they're made, not the material used.

But anyway, anyone thinking that they'll stay clear of an aluminium frame because they think it'll be harsh - all I can say is my aluminium bike is the comfiest I've ever had so as far as I'm concerned that is total rubbish.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 1:57 am
Posts: 51
Here's mine after many carbon bikes it's good to be back home on Alum


Attachments:
allez photo.JPG
allez photo.JPG [ 46.67 KiB | Viewed 1653 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:01 am
Posts: 246
Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
ecguevara wrote:
Timo wrote:
Carbon has become the material for competition bikes but steel and titanium still have their place as they are considered "classic" and "sexy". Why is it that aluminium failed to remain an attractive material for frame building?


A large part of of that is because of marketing and economics.

Aluminum has become so cheap and commonplace in our everyday lives. The ease at which aluminum can be manufactured and hydroformed into different tube shapes has driven its cost down. You can buy department store bikes for $30. Aluminum technology has "matured", there is very little that can be done with improving it.

People relate "cheap" to "inferior".

Carbon fiber is a "new" technology, even if CF has been around since the 1960s. Manufacturing carbon fiber frames is a labor-intensive process (and carbon lay-up critical), which tends to drive the cost of manufacture up.

Titanium is hard to work with, literally. This generally limits tube shapes to straight ones. Titanium manufacturing is a specialty and this drives its cost up. Its availability to a small market makes it more desirable.

Steel is well, steel. Like aluminum steel technology is already matured. Since it has fallen from the mainstream choice of frame material it has acquired a "classic" status. There's always a market for classic things - the oldies and the fans.

A lot of people buy bikes knowing very little (I'm putting myself on the wire here) of the technical merits of the frame material. Most of them just buy into the marketing put forward by the companies, driven by the market and social economics.

Quote:
Is it just me, or do more forum members wonder why aluminium seems to have become a niche for high(er) end bikes?


Companies like Cannondale has heavily invested in developing aluminum (the CAAD). Giant has always made their high-end TCR line to include aluminum. Other companies like Specialized have "resurrected" aluminum as well.

When people hear aluminum they think "common". But these companies are doing something new and different with aluminum. And being "different" sells.



Post of the month! :podium: :goodpost: :no1:


Top
 Profile  
 
Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:41 pm 


Top
  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 230 posts ] 
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 16  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 12x23, BmanX, cyclistcong, edroc73rp, toride and 26 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

   Similar Topics   Author   Replies   Views   Last post 
There are no new unread posts for this topic. Another Bike fit thread, how does my fit look? Help.

[ Go to page: 1, 2 ]

in Road

plag

26

1540

Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:09 pm

TwiggyTN View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. s-works aluminium

in MTB

ophiravina

13

1877

Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:38 pm

ophiravina View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Attachment(s) s-works aluminium 29er

in Introduce Yourself / Gallery - Please use metric weights.

ophiravina

13

2898

Sun Nov 02, 2014 6:19 pm

vfb View the latest post

There are no new unread posts for this topic. Aluminium Frames/Build

[ Go to page: 1, 2 ]

in Road

digger

17

2013

Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:39 am

theosaurus View the latest post


It is currently Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:00 pm

All times are UTC + 1 hour




Advertising   –  FAQ   –  Contact   –  Convert   –  About

© Weight Weenies 2000-2013
hosted by starbike.com


How to get rid of these ads? Just register!


Powered by phpBB