Tubless CX Setup Questions

[Oregonic]

I'm thinking about joining the ranks using tubeless for CX this year (I know, summer just got here, but I'm looking ahead). I'm looking for advice or suggestions from those of you already running tubeless.

I'd like to build something up with a true tubeless bead rim, so as to avoid rim strips, burps, etc. I'd prefer a wider rim than the standard road setup, and hopefully 25-35 mm deep. Any reliable suggestions that aren't boat anchors?

Same goes for tires - I'd prefer a true tubeless bead for the best lock (and I wish Clement made one, as I truly love the PDX). But they don't, so any tire reccomendations?

Thanks in advance for any insights!

[the_marsbar]

I have an Ultegra 6700 (tubeless) wheelset and Hutchinson Bulldog tubeless-ready tires. I am not very impressed with the performance in cyclocross to be honest. I used the setup in a race once, but if you want to run low pressure there's only one way: tubular tires.

I weigh 68-69 kgs and I had problems at 30 psi.

For road use (with Hutchinson Fusions) it's another story, that is just perfect.

[Fisherfreerider]

I ran tubeless last season with Ultegra wheels and bontrager cx-0 tires. Never had any issues and they are not tubeless tires. I wouldn't worry about finding a tubeless specific tire because all that means is the tire is heavy. Using tubulars in cross is stupid. I can easily change tires for the conditions, not worry about ruining a $100+ tire and run just as low of pressure.

[the_marsbar]

I ran tubeless last season with Ultegra wheels and bontrager cx-0 tires. Never had any issues and they are not tubeless tires. I wouldn't worry about finding a tubeless specific tire because all that means is the tire is heavy. Using tubulars in cross is stupid. I can easily change tires for the conditions, not worry about ruining a $100+ tire and run just as low of pressure.

That's not true. Tubeless-ready is not the same as tubeless. Maybe the Bulldogs are heavier (50 grams/tire) than the Bontrager tires you have, but they have bigger knobs as well! And they should work better at lower pressure. I would be surprised if your Bontragers work better (no burping, stable when turning) than the Bulldogs @ 30 psi.

Personally I feel a big difference, the rolling resistance is noticably less for my tubular setup + I can go with lower pressure without burping, and it makes me go faster in the races. I glued the tires late autumn/winter 2010 and I'll be doing my first reglue autumn this year. Not a single puncture. What's stupid?

I have mud-ish tubs (Tufo Cubus) and they've been fine on my only wheelset for two cross seasons. Of course this was suboptimal for the really dry races I've done, but on the other hand, that's less than 10% of the races...

If you have another opinion than mine, that's perfectly fine, but since I suppose you haven't used tubulars(?) I think it's a bit over the top to say that using tubulars in cross is stupid without any real arguments.

[Fisherfreerider]

I ran tubeless last season with Ultegra wheels and bontrager cx-0 tires. Never had any issues and they are not tubeless tires. I wouldn't worry about finding a tubeless specific tire because all that means is the tire is heavy. Using tubulars in cross is stupid. I can easily change tires for the conditions, not worry about ruining a $100+ tire and run just as low of pressure.

That's not true. Tubeless-ready is not the same as tubeless. Maybe the Bulldogs are heavier (50 grams/tire) than the Bontrager tires you have, but they have bigger knobs as well! And they should work better at lower pressure. I would be surprised if your Bontragers work better (no burping, stable when turning) than the Bulldogs @ 30 psi.

Personally I feel a big difference, the rolling resistance is noticably less for my tubular setup + I can go with lower pressure without burping, and it makes me go faster in the races. I glued the tires late autumn/winter 2010 and I'll be doing my first reglue autumn this year. Not a single puncture. What's stupid?

I have mud-ish tubs (Tufo Cubus) and they've been fine on my only wheelset for two cross seasons. Of course this was suboptimal for the really dry races I've done, but on the other hand, that's less than 10% of the races...

If you have another opinion than mine, that's perfectly fine, but since I suppose you haven't used tubulars(?) I think it's a bit over the top to say that using tubulars in cross is stupid without any real arguments.

Bontragers work great at 30psi. Had not a single issue last season. I had tubular Grifos last year and I can honestly say I cannot tell a bit if difference.

[the_marsbar]

Alright. Maybe I should get the Bontragers instead of the Hutchinsons I currently have then...

[Fisherfreerider]

Maybe. Never used hutchison tires. I will be trying a few setups this year because I need a mud tire as well.

[huddini]

Anyone who tried Ksyrium Elite with Challenge Grifo w/o tubes? Do I need sealant or any tape in em or will they just run out of the box?

[the_marsbar]

I highly doubt you'll be able to do without either. Given that the Ultegra wheelset I have is tubeless-ready and doesn't work all that well for me at low pressure, I would think the Ksyrium's/non-TL ready combo is even worse.

[huddini]

I highly doubt you'll be able to do without either. Given that the Ultegra wheelset I have is tubeless-ready and doesn't work all that well for me at low pressure, I would think the Ksyrium's/non-TL ready combo is even worse.

Ok thx.... I read about a guy who did TL ghetto style.... He rides regular Victoria w Stans tape on Ksyriums... Think I am gonna go Challenge Grifo...

[limba]

This should be stickied. Everything I've read about tubeless says it doesn't work for cross. I would be interested in trying it if there's been any improvement in performance.

[ms6073]

Those I know who raced tubeless last year - including Stan's Alpha tubeless road wheelsets - most suffered issues while racing. In nearly every case, it was either burping while running low pressure or lack of adequate performance running higher pressures to prevent burping. The only ones I recall not having many issues where those who ran Stan's wider 29er tubeless rims as I do not recall seeing any of the Stan's CX team having any issues last year.

[Fisherfreerider]

Check this out if you're interested.
http://www.cxmagazine.com/going-tubeles ... mendations

[rockdude]

Tubulars are the only way to go. Tubeless is not ready for prime time yet. The issue is, you will never have a tubeless setup that has the suppleness like a quality tubular and there suppleness is bases for good traction. Looking around at the top 100 pros and you will only see Tubular and there is a good reason for that.

[bc sparks]

I raced for 2 seasons on Fulcrum Racing 1 2way-fit with Vittoria tires. The set up worked perfectly down to about 30 psi (I was weighing in around 86 kg). After a few races I pulled about a dozen thorns out of each tire with out flatting or even loosing pressure.

If you have a tubless specific wheelset, I don't think tubless specific tires are necessary. I tried the hutchinson tires but they felt slow so I set up with Vittorias and they worked great, I think the Clement clinchers will work too.

Last season I switched to FMB tubular tires on HED rims, they may not be as flat proof as tubless, but they are lighter, much more supple, better traction, and all around faster. I may use a tubless set up on courses with a high potential for punctures, but for most of my races I will race on tubulars.