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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:23 am 
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Yeah Mavic has or is losing the rim only market. I'm not sure they are interested in staying in it really. Far more agile companies have arrived responding to market trends. Things like coloured and deep rims, and now wide rims. In the last four or five years Mavic has missed the boat completely.

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Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:23 am 


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:07 pm 
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Posts: 172
I wonder if it is a business decision or just limited R+D time? Opinions on Mavic wheels vary but in a lot of areas, particularly aerodynamics, they are a way behind the cutting edge. They seem to take a long while to bring stuff to market - that new wide carbon tub wheel, the M40 or whatever, seems to have been waiting in the wings for ages.

In terms of money Stan's seems to take simple but useful ideas, build very light rims and sell them for markedly more than an Open Pro would cost. I doubt the market for people who like to spec or spec and build their own wheels is that price-sensitive.

Anyway, my wishlist would be

23 mm at the brake track
low profile for comfort
light (sub 400g) even if it is a bit bendy, with plenty of spokes and decent hubs you can still build a stiff training wheel
stubby bead socket like stans so you get more volume from any given rubber
Exalith treatment
All black, easily removed decals

I'd pay double Open Pro retail for that.....


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:53 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:40 pm
Posts: 316
Location: CA
HED recently stopped selling their popular hole count C2 rims to builders. There is a $$$$ reason why manufacturers are keeping their popular rims off the market. In HEDs case I think it's a bad business move as they will sell way fewer C2 wheelsets than they would rims.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 5:43 pm 
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@billspreston - where did you hear this Re: C2 rims? Lots of places are still stocking all the drillings, surely that's not just back stock they're trying to get rid of?


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 10:03 am
Posts: 378
euan wrote:
Yeah Mavic has or is losing the rim only market. I'm not sure they are interested in staying in it really. Far more agile companies have arrived responding to market trends. Things like coloured and deep rims, and now wide rims. In the last four or five years Mavic has missed the boat completely.

Maybe its just me, but Mavic seem to be losing direction. They dont innovate. They dont offer attractive price points, they are slow to react to market demands, their rims arent THAT great anymore and nor are their hubs. People will still buy Mavic and heck I would too if they werent so expensive, but for example the cosmic carbone slr is one heck of an expensive and unaerodynamic wheel. The ksyrium while stiff, is worse than a 32spoke regular wheel. In pure performance terms, mavic are crap.
What new rims have Mavic developed in the last 10 years? Dont hold your breath for an exalith treatment rim......


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:02 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 3:31 pm
Posts: 459
Have to agree on the mavic bearings; Exalith was a good idea. I feel their market is the gentleman rouleur. Back in the day OP was the go to rim, and it is sad they havn't given it at least 1 or 2 genuine facelifts over the last 25 years. Up to last week when my rear Elite showed a crack, I thought they were unmatched in durability; my 07 aksium is still going strong. So excellent starter wheels at least, and they are supporting the ceramic bearing crowd as well, albeit it extremely indirectly.

Is the Stans Alpha as durable as the OP?; if so, i could switch over.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:05 am 
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@ticou Durable is not usually an adjective people apply to stan's rims. They are a clear 80g lighter than O-pro. Plenty of people on here seem to use them without trouble, but everything is relative....


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:24 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:46 am
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jooo wrote:
@billspreston - where did you hear this Re: C2 rims? Lots of places are still stocking all the drillings, surely that's not just back stock they're trying to get rid of?

32H are not available from Ciclismo in the UK, I've just had an exchange of email with them confirming this. You can still buy 18/20/24/28 from them at £109 per rim.

I've just offered them my opinion on the bare rims vs pre-built wheels issue, doubt it'll make any difference but I felt the need to say something :evil:



[Noob saying 'hi' btw :waving: ]


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:59 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:12 am
Posts: 2194
Location: Alto, NM
billspreston wrote:
HED recently stopped selling their popular hole count C2 rims to builders. There is a $$$$ reason why manufacturers are keeping their popular rims off the market. In HEDs case I think it's a bad business move as they will sell way fewer C2 wheelsets than they would rims.


Nah... they know what they are doing. I was selling C2 custom wheels with clearly better hubs for less than the Hed wheels cost. Even though they charge a lot of $$ for the rims their profit margin on those is what... maybe 10-20% as high as what they make on the wheelsets? So eliminating that direct competition pays off if they can swing 1 out of 5 or 10 customers wanting a C2 custom to their own wheels. Zipp has done the same with their Firecrest rims... can't get them at all. Hed has never sold their carbon rims for customs... at least they are still selling the C2s in 24-32 holecounts (in the US anyway).


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 3:31 pm
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petromyzon wrote:
@ticou Durable is not usually an adjective people apply to stan's rims. They are a clear 80g lighter than O-pro. Plenty of people on here seem to use them without trouble, but everything is relative....


Alas yes, it is! They are worth a thought though, I could rotate them with my new rear Elite. But I guess op's it'll have to be- we have plenty of niche wheelbuilders in blighty who continue to use 'em, and I guess with our road conditions we will be Mavic's main market for op style rims if were not already- they really have a stranglehold, and perhaps, just perhaps, I over tightened my spokes while truing, simply by tightening them!


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