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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:48 pm
Posts: 263
limba wrote:
Eventually, we'll have to buy them. Try finding a mtn.bike frame with v-brake mounts. Some companies don't even make any 26" mtn.bikes anymore! You have to buy a 29"er. In five years it's all going to be discs. I bet Ridley (king of Euro cross) has a disc bike next year and when Dura-Ace discs happen it's over for cantis.

Bump this thread in 2017 and we'll see how many manufacturers still have cantis mounts on their high end frames. I bet it's zero.

MTB is a different story. What happened for mtb will not in cyclocross for some simple reasons:

1) There are mtb specific groups since ever.
2) Disk brakes in mtb are a real need and they were very well welcomed by 99% of bikers (the market)
3) There is a huge difference between MTB and Cyclocross in terms of popularity, therefore the return of investment in developing disk brakes for mtb was guaranteed, that's not the case for cyclocross

Cyclocross components are inherited from road. Do you really think Shimano will develop an hydraulic DuraAce version for cyclocross ?
It would be a huge investment for a very very small market. I don't think Shimano guys are so stupid.
Even if 100% of cx riders all around the world would use disk brakes, it's still a very small market

If you have any doubt on this, please consider Shimano didn't even develop a serious cyclocross specific cantilever brake in all these years.....or... they didn't even put a DuraAce 46T chainring in their catalog etc. as just a few examples to understand how much Shimano is interested in the Cyclocross market.

You will never see an hydraulic version of DuraAce for cyclocross, unless they will do it for the road bikes....but probably this will not happen in the next 300 years

Last but not least, don't forget shifters are integrated with brakes, this leaves no chances to after-market products that could be developed by companies that have been doing good things for CX in terms of brake systems, like TRP etc.


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:55 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 4:24 am
Posts: 955
I think eventually we will see discs on road bikes too. TRP said last year that they have some sort of disc idea being developed.

You're getting them whether you want them or not.


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:58 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2007 5:58 pm
Posts: 48
Location: London
@vcnz - how many cyclocross bikes sold are ever actually raced? Do not underestimate the riders that uses a cross bike for commuting, or a mix of off road and on road riding as they are the ones driving the market.


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am
Posts: 1355
andyp wrote:
@vcnz - how many cyclocross bikes sold are ever actually raced? Do not underestimate the riders that uses a cross bike for commuting, or a mix of off road and on road riding as they are the ones driving the market.


also road racing /= the road bike market. bike manufacturers are seeing gains by ignoring UCI rules when designing frames for the tri market and they would look for similar expansion in the road market too.

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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:41 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:36 pm
Posts: 107
Have you guys not seen SRAM is doing hydraulic rim and disk brakes and STI levers for their 2012 red road group?


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 4:24 am
Posts: 955
Yeah but Sram sucks. :mrgreen:

You couldn't use their Red cassette because it filled with mud. The new cassette should have fixed that problem.... the front derailleur cage needed to be downgraded from ti to steel to work for cross and their mtn bike disc brakes have sucked for over ten years. When Shimano makes a disc brake that's when everyone will want them.


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:58 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:32 pm
Posts: 540
Location: Bow of a Farr 40
"""Those that think a lack of contact patch have obviously failed to consider an ABS (antilock Brake System) that will fix the issue of hopelessly skidding. You will be able to program your brakes for each specific race. Naturally these will need to be ceramic. They will also need to be fully hydraulic with tubes running inside the bike frame. As we are going hydraulic anyway we can also use it for front and rear suspension that can also raise and lower the bike as the terrain dictates. This could be done using a computer chip that could adjust itself on the fly. As we are running a computer it may as well adjust tire air pressure on the fly. This could be tied into the local weather report to accommodate weather conditions. This system could also turn on and adjust your built in lighting system. I could go on forever"""

Come on, don't stop there, we'll only have 1 'working' brake lever in the future with the other being a spring-weighted dummy. We'll only need 1 b/c the computer will use the ABS sensors to determine which wheel has more traction and deliver braking power to that wheel a la skid control or a 4WD diff on a WRC car. If the ABS reacts fast enuf we'll never endo again b/c the brake will cut out as wheel speed approaches zero. I would not want to be the test mule for such a set up. Imagine trusting your braking to a battery?


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 5:20 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:14 pm
Posts: 21
Disc brakes making cross bikes too heavy?

Think again...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/10/ ... -78-pounds

Image


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:02 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:36 am
Posts: 340
Think again, why are none of the European pro's riding with disc brakes?


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:51 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:54 am
Posts: 25
Location: Kansas City, MO
I was there, and listening to Johnson descend mt. krumpet was unbearable. Loudest squealing I have heard.

I worked the pit for my friend who raced earlier in the day in the same mud. He had a ss 29er with bb7s, I had to adjust the pads every lap because the water/mud was wearing them down so fast. By the end of the race he had no pad left to stop. Good thing he had a pit bike with cantis.

My cx bike is 14lbs, 16.78 sounds like a lot.

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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 8:07 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:48 pm
Posts: 263
jeronimo wrote:
Disc brakes making cross bikes too heavy?

Think again...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2011/10/ ... -78-pounds" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


...still much heavier than same bike with canti brakes


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:51 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 7:58 pm
Posts: 306
Location: Lancaster, UK
but it's heavier mainly because the technology for road/CX discs is old, not because discs are a lot heavier per se.

Once the kit catches up then you'll see lightweight disc setups. Maybe not as light as cantis I admit, but there are clear benefits that will make up for a small weight increase. Plenty of parts are slightly heavier than the ultimate lightweight kit (Di2, clincher tyres/rims, two-ring setups...) but the benefits are often worth the price/weight.


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:44 am 
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in the industry

Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:16 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Merzig-Germany
The new OCCP Step C Disk .
Complete 6,8kg.


Attachments:
OCCP-AX_light.JPG
OCCP-AX_light.JPG [ 146.82 KiB | Viewed 585 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 11:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 7:58 pm
Posts: 306
Location: Lancaster, UK
oh yes 8)

now we just need some dedicated road bikes like that :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:21 pm 
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in the industry

Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:16 pm
Posts: 76
Location: Merzig-Germany
My own bike with the new shimano ultegra di2. Frame size 58cm.Weight complete 7,2 kg with mono chainring and 7,35kg with double chainwheels. I'm sure that disk bikes are the future in cyclocross. Also by the pro riders.


Attachments:
Marketingrd_OCCP_1.JPG
Marketingrd_OCCP_1.JPG [ 83.73 KiB | Viewed 568 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: TJ wins on discs
Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:21 pm 


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