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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:10 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:11 am
Posts: 73
Hey everybody,
I got into racing about a year ago, and recently bought some new carbon racing/good day training wheels. I've been advised that switching brake pads (carbon specific-->normal alu) is a must. Do you guys do this, and is it only the brake pad that you take out, not the metal holding it or do you remove the whole bolt that connects your pad to your brake arm for replacement.(forgive my terminology! not sure of the technical names :oops: )
Some hints/tips would be much appreciated!
Thanks


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Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:10 am 


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:04 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:23 pm
Posts: 18
It's recommended and if you don't it will definitely void the warranty. However I use swissstop yellows on both my open pro alu. rims and my carbon tubulars. However I check diligently for aluminum piece that would tear up the carbon rim, although most will recommend changing out brake pads.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:42 am 
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Posts: 33
Yes - change the pads out. Otherwise the metal shavings from the aluminum rims that embed themselves into the pads will wear away the carbon rims much quicker. It is much easier to change out pads with the holder than it is to slide the pads out of the holder and slide a different set back in. Usually pads are in there pretty tight and you need to push on it with a good amount of force. Plus changing out the complete brake cartridge allows you fine tune and readjust the positioning to account for different rim and brake track widths.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:12 am 
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Location: Natovi Landing
fleshpile wrote:
Yes - change the pads out. Otherwise the metal shavings from the aluminum rims that embed themselves into the pads will wear away the carbon rims much quicker. It is much easier to change out pads with the holder than it is to slide the pads out of the holder and slide a different set back in. Usually pads are in there pretty tight and you need to push on it with a good amount of force. Plus changing out the complete brake cartridge allows you fine tune and readjust the positioning to account for different rim and brake track widths.


Your final point is not valid fleshpile as if the cartridge doesn't need moved for the new rim then it's obviously less effort not to have moved it in the first place ... if it does need moved then it's easier with the existing cartridge in place.

Swapping pads rather than cartridges is easier and more sensible IMO but each to their own.

The OP - the one thing that really matters is having different pads of the right type for alu and carbon, correctly set up. Your choice as to whether you swap cartridge or pad.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:58 am 
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Swap them, wouldn't want to find aluminium shavings in your brake pads eating away at your carbon rims, do you?

In my opinion, it's easiest to use some nice, light brake pad holders which don't have bolts to secure the pads in the holders. Then it's relatively easy and fast to switch pads. You can squeeze the brake levers so that the pads hit the brake track of your wheel, sit on the top tube of the bike, roll backwards and they will come loose. Be carefull though, otherwise the holders wil hit the brake track....


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:25 pm
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Location: Pays De Galles
In my experience pads do not easily come out of their cartridge holders. It's easier to have dedicated carbon and aluminium pads in their respective holders and swap-out accordingly.

As fleshpile says, different wheels have different rim heights so it allows adjustment each time.

I wouldn't trust any holder that didn't have a securing pin/bolt but that's just me.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:01 pm 
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Guy wrote:
... I wouldn't trust any holder that didn't have a securing pin/bolt but that's just me.


Why not? It's not like it's going anywhere? The only way it'll stop the brake pad from going is backwards. And, it's not like you're riding backwards? (or are you?)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:13 pm 
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Location: Canada
I think that the reason for the swapping of pads is that the cork pads I prefer on carbon rims do not work at all on alloy rims. I also find that it is better to swap pads and carriers together, as it is easier than trying to remove the cork pads. Lastly, depending on your wheel set, you may be required to adjust the carriers anyway.

On the subject of alloy 'shavings' from rims, I have to say that I have never seen that in the last 25 years. I can't imagine any alloy dust being more abrasive than all the sand and other ambient road crap that pads drag against our rims. If anyone has ever seen a study on this subject, I would really love to see it.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:22 pm 
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Location: Denmark
I switch pads. I usually take 10mins to prepare my self and my bike anyway - thats checking air pressure and, if needed, swap wheels and pads.

It differs very, very much from brakepad and pad holder to another as to how difficult it is to install and remove the pads in the holders.
My friend ride a Planet-x TT bike with planet-x brakepad shoes. The brakepads just slide in and out with ease. So here its the easiest just to replace the pads.

On my own bike, how ever, i need a flat head screwdriver to take out pads and some hard surface when I need to force new pads in the shoes... So here I bought an extra set of brakeshoes.

EDIT:
I dont change brakepads that often. I allmost allways ride my carbon wheels anyway. I figured they cost a fortune, so I might aswell use them :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 2:28 pm 
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Location: Santa Cruz, California, USA
I swap pads in the holders. With Shimano holders it's not too difficult. Squeeze the front brake to bring the pads in so they will slide past the fork.

Removing the holders means that you need to re-align them, and for me that takes longer than swapping pads.

Not only do carbon pads not work as well on aluminum and vice-versa, pads used on aluminum pick up shards of metal which will chew up carbon rims. Many carbon rim makers will not warranty a rim that's been abused this way.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 4:03 pm 
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Location: Natovi Landing
Guy wrote:
As fleshpile says, different wheels have different rim heights so it allows adjustment each time.

I wouldn't trust any holder that didn't have a securing pin/bolt but that's just me.


How can the first point be a plus for swapping cartridges?

Change of cartridge obviously means removing cartridges, mounting different cartridges and aligning in all cases.

Suppose the pad height doesn't have to change (as I found out for my canyon last night when swapping in Boras for Zipps) ... then if you haven't changed cartridge there is no adjusting to be done.

And even if the height does have to change, loosening and tightening an allen bolt is surely easier than the removal, mounting and aligning different cartridges.

The one argument I can see in favour of changing cartridges is the one Geoff raises - where the pad is tricky to get in or out of the cartridge.

On the second point, I much prefer a bolt too but for ease of changing pads. If you mean safety then that is just you as there are tens (hundreds?) of thousands of such holders being used daily without incident.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:13 pm 
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Location: Eugene, OR
i have been racing form 16 years, most of that time is racing on carbon wheels and training on aluminum. i have yet to ever switch out pads between the different wheels. if you use the shimano pads, they are good for both. the first time you hit your brakes with the carbon rims it will take care of whatever is in the pad. i can tell you that a little tiny piece of aluminum shaving is not going to damage a carbon rim. you can continue to buy $50 brake pads that do little other than drain your wallet, or buy the $9 shimano pads that will last most of a 50+ race season and work just as well.

scott


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:39 pm 
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Location: Kent: UK
You can often smell the riders racing on carbon rims with standard pads too. Smells like burning rubber all around you when in a heavy braking corner. It's impossible to do big descent with massive braking on standard pads mind. Just disappear within minutes.


As for the shoes with a pad bolt, this simply stops the pad sliding out when you reverse and brake as said. It's not a safety net.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:22 pm 
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I swap the pads, not the holders. They come out of my SRAM Red brakes without much trouble. So much easier then trying to adjust the holders each time.

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Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:22 pm 


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:39 pm 
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shill wrote:
i have been racing form 16 years, most of that time is racing on carbon wheels and training on aluminum. i have yet to ever switch out pads between the different wheels. if you use the shimano pads, they are good for both. the first time you hit your brakes with the carbon rims it will take care of whatever is in the pad. i can tell you that a little tiny piece of aluminum shaving is not going to damage a carbon rim. you can continue to buy $50 brake pads that do little other than drain your wallet, or buy the $9 shimano pads that will last most of a 50+ race season and work just as well.

scott


+1.......all these pad colors, etc. is just marketing hype.

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