Zipp 303 Satellites

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
8oken
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2004 6:16 pm
Location: Nantes, France

by 8oken

I am going to buy a pair of Zipp 303. I'm 21 years old, my height is 1m80 and my weight is 63kg. My problem is that I don't know how many spokes my future wheels must have. Someone has already told me that 28 spokes on the rear wheel will be the best. Do you agree with such a thing ? How many spokes for the front one ?

I have Mavic Ksyrium Elite wheels and I would like to know if the 303 are more rigid.

Thanks !

8Oken

by Weenie


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Bruiser
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Location: Sydney, Australia
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by Bruiser

I too would like to know about the 303's.
What terain do you ride?
I'm looking for a deep profile low spoke wheel to use in windy conditions.
How do people compare the AC 420 to the Kyrium and Zipp range?

Brian

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spytech
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by spytech

Get as many spokes as you can... :lol:

You should get 32 holes, if you really want to get those rims.

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Bruiser
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by Bruiser

He might be tall but he's not heavy.

It will depend on your power and the terain (hilly/windy) as to the priorities in your wheel.

Brian

8oken
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2004 6:16 pm
Location: Nantes, France

by 8oken

Spytech, do you tell that because these wheels are not enough strong ?

32 for the rear rim and how many for the front one ?

NB : I ride in Brittany, West France, where there's often wind and where there're hills.

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spytech
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by spytech

this is not the strongest of carbon rim, if they were 404 i would say you could get by with 24 spokes rear, but they are lighter and have less depth, from what i have heard they are not that stiff. i would say go with 32r/28f.

more will reply to this subject. but personally i would not ride these rims with less than 28 spokes front and rear, if your an agressive rider go with 32h rear.

Joel
Posts: 751
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2003 1:43 pm
Location: Belgium

by Joel

Zipp 303s don't come in 32 for the rear

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Superlite
Posts: 2492
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 9:01 pm

by Superlite

Forget Zipp, get Reynolds Stratus UL KOM. Much stonger, more aero, and about same weight, a little lighter, alot lighter, around 1000g if you swap hubs. 16/20 spoke count to!

But dude, are these for racing, training, everyday use? If they are for training forget carbon tubulars, get a good set of clinchers.

benz76
Posts: 152
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2003 11:00 am
Location: Reggio Emilia, ITALY

by benz76

@ 8oken

I know the conditions you have in Bretagne, and I'd avoid a deep profile wheel. You have too much wind, too rough road surfaces (I've pedaled on the road from Paris to Brest, following two team-mates who were racing PBP).

Personally I'd switch to a low profile wheel. Alu rim: Campagnolo Neutron , while if you like carbon: Corima Winum. Corimas are very strong, stiff and durable.

Notice that i'm not saying Zipp's are not good wheels... simply I don't suggest them to you.

Bye, Benz.

JTC
Posts: 571
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 6:05 pm

by JTC

If you are using them for Tri races your best bet is probably the 404's b/c they are a little more aero and probably a little more stiff. As with any carbon rim I reccomend that you do not train all the time on them. I use mine on race day and the occasional fast group ride. I have 303's and 404's. Have not tried the the 404's yet but plan on trying them Sat. in the mountains. The 303's I have been using for years. I am heavier than you and I think they are the stiffest wheels I have ridden (including Ksyriums, Neucleons etc...). As far as aero; they are not so deep that they provide a huge advantage for tri races, so I would guess that the 404's would be better depending on what your races are like. I built mine up with spada hubs and they are only about 150-170g heavier than my 303's. Also as far as spoke count the 404's have 18 front and 24 rear. To be honest I am not sure about the 303's. I beleive they are the same so I wouldn't worry to much about the spoke count/strenth factor. If you want the wheels to be a little more durable go for more spokes, but at your weight it shouldn't be a problem.

mises
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 9:28 pm
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by mises

I don't know where the not stiff idea comes from about the Zipp rims. If you take a bare aluminum rim and try and bend it, it's pretty easy. In fact I used to do it with all alu rims before I built a wheel to make sure they were flat before I started. I have tried to do the same thing with a Zipp 280 rim just to see how much it would deflect and it didn't move at all (certainly if I kept increasing the force it would probably have broken at some point, but I didn't want to sacrifice my wallet in the name of science). So if your wheels are not stiff it's because it's bad quality spokes, bad wheelbuilding or not enough spokes. Below a certain number of spokes you aren't going to have a stiff wheel regardless of the rim used.

With standard spoking the lowest I would go is 28 rear and 20 on the front with CX-Rays. With triplet spoking on the rear 24 would be ok (16 drive/8 non-drive) but I would use a 14g bladed spoke for the non-drive ones. For TT's lower would be fine but any descending or fast corners and you're going to notice it.

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Tsielio
Posts: 380
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:15 pm

by Tsielio

don't take zipp 303
i broke mine several times...
they arent stiff at all!
the way you talk about bending a rim... it doesn't say anything about stiffnes!!!!
carbon fibre is totally different

go for corima winium!

gholl
Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 12:35 am

by gholl

I can offer the following comparative, but subjective, information on Kysrium and Zipp 303 wheels since I have used both for several years.
Zipp's are a stiffer, lighter wheel, however, as others have already noted, they are more fragile, and I have experienced both spoke and wheel breakage. Zipp is an excellent company and has repaired my wheels-even after their warranty period expired!
As for the spokes, I see the critical issue not as the number of spokes, but the type of spokes-Sapims are what you need-there're stronger, stiffer and produce less breakage.
Again, I must underline the opinions already given here regarding your choice of wheels. Zipp 303's are not a good wheel for windy, wet conditions-both bike control and braking will be compromised. If you must use these wheels, Zipp brake pads are imperative.
Like many other riders, I prefer Campy Nucleons in bad weather-they're low profile, strong and have an excellent braking surface. Their downside is tire removal is necessary before spoke adjustment.

8oken
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2004 6:16 pm
Location: Nantes, France

by 8oken

Thanks for all your comments !

In fact, I want to buy great aero/light wheels. I will use them only in very good conditions (not under the rain). I don't do triathlon races. I would like to buy Zipp 404 but because my weight is quite low, I am afraid to be disturb by the wind... And I don't want to buy Corima Winium or Campa Nucleon because I want a deep rim. I want to make me a pleasure in buying these wheels. I don't really need new wheels but I have had money and I want to spend it in wheels.

Do you think that if I buy Zipp 303, it would be better if I buy only the rim and I go to a wheels maker in order to have good spokes ? If the answer is "Yes", which spokes I must put on them ?

8Oken

by Weenie


Terminator
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 6:42 pm

by Terminator

8oken wrote:In fact, I want to buy great aero/light wheels. I will use them only in very good conditions (not under the rain). I don't do triathlon races. I would like to buy Zipp 404 but because my weight is quite low, I am afraid to be disturb by the wind... And I don't want to buy Corima Winium or Campa Nucleon because I want a deep rim. I want to make me a pleasure in buying these wheels. I don't really need new wheels but I have had money and I want to spend it in wheels.


Ever thought about buying the real thing?

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