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 Post subject: New Zipp 404 Firestrike
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 1:17 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 6:06 am
Posts: 876
Location: Perth, Western Australia
New Zipp 404 Firestrike weigh in at 1620g. My 2008 Zipp 404's weigh 1660g.
I honestly can't figure why a full carbon clincher will weigh only 40g less than a carbon alloy clincher that was designed by the same company over 10 years ago. So much for progress or lack thereof.
I know this is simplistic, but how much real progress are we making and how much is marketing hype?
I love technology and new bits for my bike, but often it seems gains are so incremental that manufacturers are releasing new bikes, wheels, group sets, shoes, helmets, etc that are supposed to be so much better, but in real world riding yield far less impressive results or just don't live up to the hype.

http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/arti ... uts-41409/


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:02 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:40 am
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Location: Switzerland
it takes a lot of carbon to produce a clincher rim that does not explode under heavy brake loads

i estimate the volume of carbon used (especially the brake tracks) with a reliable clincher rim is 5 x that of aluminum


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Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:02 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:05 pm 
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Location: Denmark
That's why disc brakes are nice ;)

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:09 pm 
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GT56 wrote:
it takes a lot of carbon to produce a clincher rim that does not explode under heavy brake loads

i estimate the volume of carbon used (especially the brake tracks) with a reliable clincher rim is 5 x that of aluminum



That plus the newer Zipps (FC and now FS) are much wider than the 404s of old plus the depth of the new 404FS was increased.

Looking at the numbers Zipp provided, the aero between the FC and FS is very similar. Probably within standard of error. But the braking is better according to Zipp. Don't think it is worth selling your FC wheels just to get the FS. That would be a waste IMO.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:26 am
Posts: 106
So it looks like Zipp has released new firestrike clinchers. These seem to be the same aerodynamically as firecrest, but with better braking, sideforce, and are slightly wider.

However they are almost 50% more expensive than the firecrest! Much too expensive for me!

Thoughts?

http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Zipp ... _4398.html


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:38 pm 
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$3600. No thanks.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:43 pm 
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The price makes no sense? You could buy custom enves for that price..


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:25 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:07 pm
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Location: The Lone Star State
I don't understand where they got this price from. I originally thought these would be the next generation 404, phazing out the Firecrest line, but I guess they aren't (for the moment, at least). I can understand a premium if these wheels were significantly lighter than the 404's (202 weight at 404 performance, etc.), but $1,000+ more for "better braking"? Nah, I'll pass.

Actually, I do understand where this price comes from: triathletes will pay a premium (even more than road cyclists)!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:36 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:29 pm
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Location: UK
if you want better braking, pay $1000 less and get some alu rims :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:48 pm 
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Which Alu wheels cost $2600?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:49 pm 
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Triathletes don't even need to brake that much!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:01 pm 
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Location: The Lone Star State
That's the sad part!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 5:17 pm 
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Zipp need to be lowering costs instead of raising them. The market cannot handle higher prices (in any appreciable annual usage) than the prices they have now. They need a carbon clincher "flashpoint" line.

Edit: I see that this is intended for low volume. However, they do need a <$1500 carbon clincher line, far-east made, low cost hubs, and different (low cost specific) brand name. The flashpoint name was a weird choice. I'm sure they can do better than that now.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:36 pm 
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I can buy 2 full sets of Boyd's as well as a disc for 3600...


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Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:36 pm 


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:56 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:09 pm
Posts: 730
Yeah, built 2 really nice Asian HongFu wide aero sets of wheels with CXRays, Tune/Alchemy hubs for $2800. Of course, Alchemy ORC UL rear hub has a flaw, replacing it with a DT240s for the rear training clinchers.

40mm clinchers 1310g, 56mm tubulars 1294g.

I will say this though, Zipp braking with Platinum Pro pads, very strong. Best carbon braking setup I had. With that said, could always stop with current wheels and Far/Near brakes same pads.

I guess it has been several years, Zipp has made a ton of money, so time to invest in some new molds and implement a few new technologies for the market segment and still claim they are the wheel leader in the business.


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