AX Lightness Vial EVO

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AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
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Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

Hi Freddy,
The decision for the Stealth over the LTD has in the first place been down to the available finishes. 3T does not supply us with unfinished forks with the Stealth fitting better into the overall theme of the bike. Looking at the test results the technical properties of the LTD - except for the slight weight advantage - have also not been favorable in comparison to the Stealth, which made the decision pretty much straightforward.
For the absolute high end market we do have the THM version anyways (not saying that there would be anything wrong with the 3T though)!

That said we have in the meantime received the first batch of THM Scapula CT forks. These are still unfinished, so don't be surprised about the appearance. The fork would now still require to be coated respectively alternatively the headtube partially finished in a matching fiber cloth for a pleasing transition. In regards to the proportions I think both go together very well :thumbup:
Image Image
~Nils

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spytech
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by spytech

Do you yet have any info on frame stiffness, also could you elaborate on the special elastomer layer? is it like the Kraibon resin that rolo uses in their bikes?

how would you compare the vial evo, to the other high end bikes that are not manufactured in far east china - for example, the Rca and rolo bikes. seeing as your bike is half the cost of the others, is their anything that is left out that was cost prohibitive? could the bike be improved on with higher cost of material or a more labor intensive process? is diminishing returns too high at this point or this is exactly what you guys aimed for? sorry if the questions are a bit awkward, just wondering...

also anymore info on the road clinchers?

i still say a disc version of this bike would be amazing, not that this bike isnt already. now with the thm fork option, its all German (nice move). thm, has to be devoloping a road disc fork? any inside secrets on that? we need a lite option.

by the way, is that a carbon pot for the plant in the background of the 2nd picture?

AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
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Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

So far we have only done prototype stiffness tests at the university lab closeby in Bayreuth. These are only qualitative tests for us in comparison to other models that have been tested (as well as all of our previous models) as whilst the testing procedure is in-line with the industry standard the resulting figures aren't (due to a different leverage and weights). The predecessor, the Vial non-Evo, had scored a 1.3 (96 Nm/°) in lateral stiffness and a 1.0 (62 N/mm) in the test of Tour Magazin 04/2013, 1.0 being the best possible mark, and was touted as being suitable also for sprinters. The Vial EVO is targeted to match these figures, but will of course also be featured in tests both in Tour Magazin as well as its counterpart RoadBike.

I cannot talk about other people's frames and have to stress that I find both of the mentioned frames really exceptional and sort of a benchmark at the moment. The difference with us, if my understanding with them is correct, is that we actually also build them in-house in our own factory.
Of course technically you could always spend more money for a given project, however as you already indicate with the diminished returns at a certain point it is no longer worth it. So despite of actually utilizing aerospace materials for the frame (similar to Rolo: M55J, M46J, M40J), we are actually not talking about aerospace and neither a design object here. Of course we could have booked several windtunnel hours to have nice graphs (and not only relied on CFD) or we could have had big sponsoring budgets that needed to be refinanced or simply engage a well-known designer to make the frame stand out aesthetically (not referring to any of the mentioned frames above), but we have tried at a more sober approach down to the technology available today as well as the great manufacturing possibilities given by our facility. There is shortly going to be a factory report on BikeRadar that will grant a view behind the scenes with us and eventually give some more insights. :thumbup:
Having read your post whilst just having watched the Club World Cup finals in soccer I had to laugh a bit: Game being FCB (FC Bayern Munich, AX is from Bayern (=Bavaria)) vs. RCA: 2-0. RCA here was Raja Casablanca from Morocco though.. :lol:
Image


In regards to the clinchers: We have just laminated the very first prototypes just today! We momentarily have company holidays from Monday until Jan 6th 2014, but then I will be able to show off the first pictures. Targeted weight is well below 1100 gms / set whilst coming with a 28 mm deep and 26 mm wide aero profile. :beerchug:

The Vial EVO disc version as mentioned is targeted for a presentation at Eurobike 2014. We have already been in talks about the disc fork as well (...), but I cannot say more here just yet.
~Nils


P.S.: The carbon pot for the plant is only fake carbon. However you will find all sorts of carbon gimmicks in Axel's office: The table for instance has real carbon legs and there is also a set of carbon shot glasses as well as tons of motorsport and cycling bits around: F1 front wings, LeMans oil tanks, F1 brake exhausts, full carbon car wheels, F1 front and rear wishbones etc etc. Well worth a visit - mine is a bit less spectacular, but sports the one or other jewelry and prototype as well. If anyone ever wants to pay us a visit, just give me a shot. You definitely are welcome with us. :thumbup:

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spytech
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by spytech

Keep us updated on the carbon clinchers... whats the weight of the first laminated set? whats been done to keep the heat under control with braking on the rim? pictures please.

hopefully you can get to market by march?

mike
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by mike

nils, always a pleasure to hear from you. glad that you are back with ax lightness. the ax cages and bottle you sent me are still holding up well.

AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
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Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

Hi Mike,
Great hearing from you and nice to see that you are still happy with the cages. As you see we still have "your" Morpheus in our program as well :thumbup: Hope all is well!!!



In regards to the road clinchers spytech:
As promised I have been taking the first pictures just yesterday once having been back in office:

Image Image
Image Image

The rim as mentioned is 28 mm deep and 26 mm wide, hence it will eventually go by the name "SRT 28 Clincher". It will come in a 20 or 24 hole count or of course as a complete wheelset.
In regards to the (rim) technology I have been starting to be adding some info on our rims on our homepage which may be worth a look. You will find the info under different tabs pretty much on top of the product pages on top of the product pictures; for the SRT 28 Clincher all the info of the other road rims apply too (such as from the SRT 24) as well as the clincher hook technology from our MTB clinchers (such as from the 650B clincher rim). Here one will also find the exact info on what is being done against the heat issues from rim brakes with our rims. :thumbup:

In regards to the SRT 28 Clincher directly: Basically we have been building on the great success from our MTB clinchers, however we have still been constructing a couple different versions with different layups/reinforcements for the hooks that are now being stress tested in a testing lab to evaluate which is the best version. The first pressure and stability tests have in the meantime already been passed. The targeted weight for the rim is 320 grams (the prototypes have still been a bit lighter depending on the layup and reinforcement), the complete wheelset 1060 grams. Safety of course is a major concern hence rather the additional weight than to be promising too much up front. We will now have to wait for the test results.
~Nils

Erikerac
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Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 3:11 pm
Location: Paris, France

by Erikerac

Anyway Nils, we're just now waiting for final painting...
Eric (from France) :wink:

AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

Hi Eric :waving:
We are currently having two separate design offices working on the final design. The first mock-ups have arrived with us on Friday and have already been really promising! I hope to be having something to show-off by the end of the next week.


There's the announced report on our manufacture up on BikeRadar in the meantime as well, granting a view behind the scenes with us.
You of course also are very welcome to step by with us in person - just drop me a note (also on short notice) and I will arrange things. :thumbup:
~Nils

AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

Finally and after a really long process of optimisation we are able to present the final version of the Vial EVO, i.e. both in regards to the technical as well as also aesthetical side of things. :D

Having been working hard on optimising the layup of the frame over the last couple of weeks in order to meet our desired blend of stiffness and comfort, and having tested various different layups on our in-house test bench to check and confirm the simulations, we can now happily claim to be having finalised the technical aspects of the frame. In order to confirm our own tests we have been testing the latest prototype at an external testing facility this week having achieved a lateral stiffness of 108 Nm/degree for a size L/56 and a weight of 687gms (without paint and FD clamp which will eventually add another 25g combined), yielding a superb STW value (as well as also absolute stiffness). The layup is now still going to be impact/crash tested as well as fatigue tested at a popular German testing institute to proove that light weight, stiffness and durability (as well as comfort) can go hand in hand.
The nude prototype looked as followed:
Image


In the meantime we have also been very busy in finalising the design of the frame, working together with several design studios and going over dozens of different versions. The aim has been to have a discreet, subtle yet not dull or uninspired design that will accommodate the technical approach of the frame and go will with a wide range of components (so not limit the customer to a specific setup or colour).
So please meet our Vial EVO :beerchug:
Image
Image
~Nils

dchesrown
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:32 pm

by dchesrown

Looks great. Congrats on getting this done. When will it be available?

Stegger
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Location: Denmark

by Stegger

It looks really great Nils - can't wait to see it in real life!

AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

Glad you like it :-D

ETA on the frame is as soon as March. With all the preorders we are currently eventually already looking at May for new orders.
~Nils

tharmor
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Joined: Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:20 am

by tharmor

Proprietary fork as well? Or is that just in the CAD illustrations?

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HammerTime2
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Location: Wherever there's a mountain beckoning to be climbed

by HammerTime2

Nils, from the order page, it looks like the frame can be ordered by someone in the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, i.e., North Korea, whose leader recently ordered the execution of all members of his uncle's family, including children, yet the United States is not listed as an option. Is this correct?

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AXAxel
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
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Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:24 pm

by AXAxel

That indeed is a very unpleasant flaw in our system.. Thanks for locating it HammerTime! Sadly and in contrast to our website the webshop backend is not administered by ourselves, only the content is. We will have a new, revamped and merged website up in summer, but the 'glitch' will still for sure have to be corrected beforehands as this indeed is an unacceptable but even more so unexplainable flaw ( :?: :!: :?: ): The United States of course absolutely have to be an option and I can only ask everyone to simply be mailing us in the meantime in order for us to sort you out directly.


The fork I think is meant to sort of replicate the looks of the 3T Rigida Stealth that the Vial EVO comes with by default. Alternatively there as well would be the "D" version with a THM Scapula CT fork as mentioned above/before.
The latter might actually still get a small additional detail into the design in order to differentiate the two versions.
~Nils

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