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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:24 pm 
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My training for the time being is limited to early morning indoor sessions 5-6 days per wk 90-120mins(max) mainly SST, Low cadence intervals, Tempo & Threshold work, usually at the weekend I can get in 1 or 2 LSD 4-6hr rides but due to the current weather that is not likely to happen for at least the next few weeks.

What would be the best type of indoor session that I could replace these LSD rides with to maintain my endurance, please don't say a 4-6hr indoor LSD session, a 2hr Z2 ride is about my max on the trainer.

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Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 12:24 pm 


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:10 pm 
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Location: Canada
If you're just looking to maintain aerobic endurance, why don't you take this opportunity to try something new like cross-country skiing. My understanding (please correct me if I'm wrong), but aerobic endurance isn't sport specific.

The thought of 2+ hours indoors is horrifying!


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:36 pm 
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Sorry, aerobic fitness is highly sport specific. There definitely is some transfer between aerobic disciplines but not as good as the yield from training in your specific sport.

Why the low cadence intervals?

Anyhow nothing wrong with just doing 2hra of LSD, just won't be as effective as 5+ that's all. Additionally adding some VO2max style efforts could help (sub 10mins). I mentioned in another thread that there is some thought that 3min efforts are very effective at working VO2max.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:16 pm 
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Location: Norway
Most of the Norwegian pros does a lot of cross country skiing before the racing season starts, doesn't seem to hinder them. If the weather doesn't allow outdoor cycling and you can't stand doing more than two hours on your trainer, then skiing will be a perfect replacement. And it is definitely good to actually exercise more than just your legs once in a while.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:20 am 
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Thanks for the replies, Tapeworm the low cadence intervals I was referring too are 10-15mins x 3-4, seated high gear trying to keep a cadence of 60-70 bringing my HR up to mid Z5.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:23 am 
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Any particular reason for the low cadence? If that's your self-selected range then fine, but there are no reasons to deliberately go this low.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:08 am 
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I don't aim to go that low, but as fast as I can within the gear that I am in, about 60-70 usually brings my HR up to mid Z5 and higher, this morning I preformed 4x10min intervals like that. I do intervals like that indoors which will hopefully help me to climb better.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:48 pm 
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Location: South Carolina
Split the time into two sessions.

One morning and one afternoon, you can get the time in that way.

I have done this, dont like too, but I also dont like training in the rain when it is close to 40 degrees outside either, recipe for getting sick.

It is tough either way. Like Tapeworm stated though, instead of doing just LSD, do some sweet spot intervals, 3 X 10 at right between threshold and tempo, you are still working the aerobic side.

HUMP

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:01 pm 
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I recommend trying to do 3 hours on the trainer on those days. I know it is longer than you want to ride inside, but I can assure you that after a few times doing 3 hours inside it will not feel as long and torturous. Even try working up to 3, adding 15 minutes per ride for a few weeks.

I agree with the posts above about adding in some good quality aerobic intervals. Tempo and sweet spot can go a long way on the trainer. I actually prefer to do most of my winter training indoors because it is much more comfortable than riding in 30 degree weather and allows me to build a much stronger aerobic base. There is nothing like riding for 3-4 hours with absolutely no coasting.

If your 6 hour outdoor rides average 190 watts/700ish Kj per hour (just an example), try to aim for an average wattage that is on the higher end of the same zone, or on the low end of the next one up, say 220-230 watts/800-830ish kj/hr (once again just an arbitrary example). You may not burn the same 4200 kj you would on the 6 hour ride, but you will at least have an energy output that is a little closer to the outdoor ride than you would if you just piddle along on the trainer. It will also give you a larger amount of time to recover, which could have even bigger benefits.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:09 pm 
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Location: Maryland
I like to break up the ride with what I'm watching/riding to.

Example - Two episodes of whatever Netflix show I'm currently running through (Battlestar Gallactica atm) = 1:40 mins on the rollers at tempo, then switch to a interval tape (sufferfest) for an hour, staying on the rollers if I don't want to hit it too hard, or switching to the trainer if I really want the full interval extremes. Cool down. Total is almost 3 hrs, mostly steady, with some punches thrown in from the sufferfest.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:22 pm 
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was really windy and horrible here today, so i did my zone 2 ride indoors. this is the second time I've done 3 hours on the turbo and it flew by today. no problems at all.
have tried zone 2 rides in extreme windy conditions before and its hard to get the intensity right when you're struggling to even stay on the road.

Totals
Duration: 3:05:51
Time Riding: 3:01:13
Distance (km): 82.1
Work (kJ): 2091
Elevation Gain (meters): 7

Averages
Speed (km/h): 28.0
Power (watts): 192
Heart Rate (bpm): 138
Cadence (rpm): 103

Aerobic Decoupling (%): 1.93

Critical Power (watts): 306
Zone Description Low (watts) High (watts) Time %
Z1 Active Recovery 0 168 03:34 2
Z2 Endurance 168 229 2:56:04 97
Z3 Tempo 229 275 01:38 1
Z4 Threshold 275 321 00:01 0


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:27 pm 
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Location: DC
I second going by KJ and TSS indoors rather than time. I've seen so many different equivalents given- trainer time is 1.25 times road time, etc. and in the end its easier to not approximate by using multipliers and just go by total energy used. Having rollers or a trainer with tilt helps just so you can stretch the legs out a bit.

I find that doing two sessions a day is not very advantageous to doing 1 session that is shorter or has lower total output. You will not completely recover for the 2nd session and since there is a huge break between them it doesn't have the same cumulative effect.

FWIW I have found that my comfortable LSD pace indoors is about 750 kj/hr with no intervals. If I do a vo2 session indoors I will easily rack up 850-900/hr. My same wattage outdoors is often close to 100kj/hr lower because of coasting, stops, surges, etc. A 3 hr indoor ride often racks up close to 2200 kj for me, but a 3 hr outdoor ride might be 400-500kj lower. Put a good movie on, have adequate fans and go for it. I used to not be able to manage more than 90 minutes, but I can now do 3 hrs fairly easily.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:40 pm 
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Location: Eastern Coast of the Baltic Sea
I'm with KWalker here, approx 700kJ/hour is easily manageable and comfortably falls in upper endurance / lower tempo zone.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:25 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 2:01 am
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Location: Canada
Tapeworm wrote:
Sorry, aerobic fitness is highly sport specific. There definitely is some transfer between aerobic disciplines but not as good as the yield from training in your specific sport.


Hmm? I stand corrected. I thought I remember reading that somewhere, perhaps in J. Friel's book. Maybe I'm confusing base with prep. Either way, me or my boys couldn't stand 3 h indoors, haha.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:13 pm 
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As someone that only did on the bike workouts for many years I reluctantly agree with Tapeworm.............yea you know there is a "but" coming. It does make you fast on the bike but may lead you open to injury, strains and sprains mostly. As a matter of fact I am in a walking cast at the moment. Chipped a bone at a tendon attachment on my ankle jumping into bed :oops: . Doctor said it was a form of "muscle imbalance" (his term) a term that some none doctors on this forum like to discount :noidea: . I had to smile as I remembered this topic being discussed before on this forum. He explained that my muscles were strong enough to damage this attachment. He recommended more weight bearing workouts (after I recover). If anyone wants the X-rays to see what this "imaginary" thing can do let me know. I had read about this before but discounted the possibility in my case as I assumed it was more an issue with pros. Also I am a fencing coach but have not personally fenced in a decade so no real weight bearing exercise there. So I guess old age and neglect must be to blame :unbelievable: Anyway I am not so fast on the bike at the moment, injury can do that :beerchug:

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Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:13 pm 


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