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 Post subject: Cadence training
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:15 pm 
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in the industry

Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:32 pm
Posts: 3139
This should be in the training section!

Does anyone have any tips for cadence training? I just got the cadence kit for my road bike, to allow the existing wired speed only kit to replace wireless kit on the mountain bike (can anyone explain to me what the point of a wireless front wheel sensor is?) I rode it for the first time this morning, and am spinning 85 - 100 rpm on a very falt 16km to work with a speed 27 - 32 km/h when moving. Should I aim for a set cadence and always try to ride at that (90 rpm for example - looking forward to trying that on the ride the Wight!) ignoring my speed and just concentrating on spinning effeciently?

Oh, and how do I convince my girlfriend that a winter training holiday in Majorca is more important than going skiing?

Thanks Rich


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:21 pm 
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Location: Des Moines, IA
Yes, Yes, no wires cleaner, Yes(depends on rider, you like to spin or hammer, most people say spin), Yes and I don't know.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:29 pm 
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You're right.. should be in training section. :? But.. you want cadence training then get a fixie. Best way to work on cadence and smoothness.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:51 pm 
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It is in the training section... :wink:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:14 pm 
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bobalou wrote:
You're right.. should be in training section. :? But.. you want cadence training then get a fixie. Best way to work on cadence and smoothness.


Do you mean use a turbo trainer, or a fixed gear? More bikes is not an option, rented accom means there are only so many bikes one landlord is willing to tolerate inside a house! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Cadence training
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:43 pm 
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richardtoddywoddy wrote:
Oh, and how do I convince my girlfriend that a winter training holiday in Majorca is more important than going skiing?



With a lot of beggin and grovelling, if she isnt a rider herself, your in for a tough time.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:34 am 
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Chris Carmichael in his book "The Ultimate Ride: Get Fit, Get Fast, and Start Winning with the World's Top Cycling Coach" suggests workouts based on cadence

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:10 am 
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Bobalou should probably expand on his thought that a fixed wheel helps with cadence. Being restricted to a small gear is a good way to improve leg speed. I prefer motorpacing for such training but it can be done of any bike as long as you don't shift to a larger gear when you're spinning out.

For good technique, trying XC. Riding up steep and slipery hills is a great way to ensure you have a smooth pedal stroke.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:01 pm 
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richardtoddywoddy wrote:
bobalou wrote:
You're right.. should be in training section. :? But.. you want cadence training then get a fixie. Best way to work on cadence and smoothness.


Do you mean use a turbo trainer, or a fixed gear? More bikes is not an option, rented accom means there are only so many bikes one landlord is willing to tolerate inside a house! :D


Sorry to hear more bikes aren't an option. I usually find more a necessity! :twisted:

Yes, I mean a fixed gear. I've ridden fixies a little and can say it will force you to ride a high cadence. On a geared bike it's much easier to fall into a lower and lazier cadence. No such option on a fixie. And the forced peddling will naturally make you smoother. I'm probably not explaining it well.. it's not easily described actually. Best thing is to try it if you can.

The same is true in riding a tandem .. I've been finding myself riding stoker lately and it's great, great training. Higher cadence is more efficient especially for tandem riding. It helps both riders equal out their power outputs more evenly. Having a good captain with good cadence technique that understands this is a big part of that.. doesn't often take my higher gear requests very seriously.

A last suggestion is to use rollers. The regular fluid or mag trainers are okay ..but rollers are smoother at a higher cadence and again, will force you more into that mode and to get the feel of a smoother powerstroke. Excellent for technique, even powerstroke and a higher cadence.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:16 pm 
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Posts: 640
Location: Boulder, CO
Look, you don't need to buy a new bike, or use a trainer to work on your cadence. My last coach was very specific as to what cadences I was supposed to be using. In early season on long aerobic rides, I'd be going for hours on end between 100-120rpms.

Now, since you haven't worked on this before, here's what you do:
1) find the cadence where you just start to bounce around.
2) take sections of your rides and train yourself at a cadence just below that, focussing on a smooth pedal stroke.
3) after a while (week, 2, depending how often you ride), take your target and raise it 5-10 rpms. Now use this as your zone during the cadence sections of your workouts.

Eventually, you will be able to sustain high cadences for long periods of time. When I was racing on the track, it was not uncommon to be doing 140rpm down the road for pretty good clips.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:30 pm 
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Posts: 1332
http://www.spindoctor-training.com/spindoctor.html

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:26 pm 
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Racing Aardvark wrote:
Look, you don't need to buy a new bike, or use a trainer to work on your cadence.


Yes of course .. and let me simplify this even more. For higher cadence: 1) pedal faster. :lol: :lol:

My suggestions were just that.. of course you don't "need" to get a fixie or a tandem ( :shock: $$) or a set of rollers. But all those things have helped me and many others I know.. nevertheless, I'm still a masher, I just mash a little faster now. :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:13 pm 
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Location: Sydney, Australia
The idea that a fixie helps with technique is a myth, as nothing happens to make you put pressure on the pedals, just that you don't decrease your cadance rapidly (if you do your back wheel will jump in the air).

It's only while slowing that the pedals are pushing against your feet. UCI junior rollout restrictions have the same impact as riding a fixie

Some of the least smooth techniques I've seen have been from very good trackies.

Motorpacing on a track is a very good opportunity to work on leg speed, but is no different to locking your front ring out and motorpacing on the road. Opportunities to motorpace are much higher on the track.

Rollers are a good method if they're an option.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:55 pm 
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Bruiser wrote:
The idea that a fixie helps with technique is a myth, as nothing happens to make you put pressure on the pedals, just that you don't decrease your cadance rapidly (if you do your back wheel will jump in the air).


I don't see how it's a myth. I'm not really in a position to defend riding a fixie as being a help to technique as I haven't ridden one much .. but just as you say some with bad technique are trackies I'll say some of the best I've seen are such.

Also, if anyone has bad mechanics (i.e., positioning problems, pronation, etc.) then it will really show it's ugly head on a fixie. All my fixie friends will swear it's made them smoother riders and increased their cadence.. and maybe that's half the battle at least - if THEY believe it just might be true.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 10:59 pm 
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Being limited to a small gear at high speed helps with a smooth stroke, but that can be acheived on a small ring.

At first you might think that a fixed wheel makes you pedal (as you can't stop) but you legs are used to moving with the pedal as they're connected to the pedal normally.

Rollers make you pedal smoothly in order to keep your balance.

Part of high cadance work is training your nerves to fire quicker (particularly with new riders) though many riders also need to train their muscles to contract quicker.

High cadance pedaling is the flavour of the month due to Lance's success, but we also saw Jan using a low cadence very well, so it's not like one works better than the other, rather that some legs prefer one over the other (muscle fatigue and power output being the main issues).


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